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  1. HP-Agilent-Keysight-Equipment
  2. Messages
Expanded Topics Messages
Date
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

"Paul Bicknell" <admin@...> writes:

Thank you for the link but I personally would hold back from StarTech racks
as they do not seem to have an easy facility to put in side runners / side
supports

The big issue here is are you buying new or second hand or better being
given the rack
Secret hear is to let contractors know you are wanting racks my past
project I found a store of 20 + racks so had a field day and pinched all I
wanted
Suggest you look at old TV studios as the TV equipment has got smaller

There are 3 methods of putting in side supports / Runners

Method 1 Fix to the single row of cage nut holes back and front
Problem here is that these mountings can clash with the
equipment mounting holes in the equipment rack flanges / wings / ears
Method 2 these racks have an additional set of holes running vertical but
back from the front panel by approx. 1.5 inch so you do not actually use the
front vertical row of cage nut holes to mount the side runners / side
supports
Problem with both of the above is that you require side
runners / side supports the correct length to go with the cabinet

Method 3 these racks have an additional set of holes running vertical at
each corner but set at 90 degrees to the front panel
Advantages these are much easier to install equipment and reconfigure
You do not have to use all the same length runners
By drilling extra holes in the side runners / side
supports used in method 1 & 2 they can be used for method 3
Installing sliding trays tables and drawers is
much easier

I must admit that I possibly reconfigure 19 racks more than most as my
friend and I reconfigured 14 off 19inch racks earlier this year

Best suggestion is to design a bench lay out possibly including 19 racks and
be on the lookout while you build the bench
Please note they come in different depths and depending on the equipment but
providing you do not require a rear door the equipment can pultrude out of
the back
Thanks for this note Paul. I actually just noticed the same thing about
30 min ago and ruled out the StarTech racks. Was about to post about
this, so your response is timely.

It looks like the NavePoint racks have the proper 90degree inner
mounting holes for the runners:



Am I correct and thinking this satisfies method 3 you mentioned above?
I didn't actually see any navepoint side runners that mount to these
90degree holes though. How do I search for these? Are they typically
called "19 inch rack side supports", or "19 inch rack runners", or
something else? Or if you know of a good source of these I'd be curious
to hear it.

Thanks
Matt
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Dear Michael and James?

?

Confused hear what have your postings to do with the Subject ???

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Michael A. Terrell
Sent: 08 November 2021 17:37
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

?

Yes, it was 'Point Of Sale' hardware. I bought both minicomputers, ten in counter LASER scanners along with 14 cash registers and 14 printers. Two complete systems, from two stores..They threw in two chargers and an electric pallet jack, all for $100. I scraped the scanners for the LASER tubes and power supplies. I sold them for $400, and I got about $75 for the machined aluminum housings. The profits went to more equipment for the shop, at the Orlando Hamfest.

?

On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 11:48 AM Jim Ford <james.ford@...> wrote:

I take it POS stands for Point Of Sale, not Piece Of S***.? When I was in engineering school in the 1980s, we used the DEC Pro 350 computers, and they actually had an operating system called pOS!? Not a well thought out name!? ? ? ?Jim Ford?

?

?

?

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

?

-------- Original message --------

From: "Michael A. Terrell" <terrell.michael.a@...>

Date: 11/8/21 12:33 AM (GMT-08:00)

Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

?

There are also 23" wide racks that came from the Telco industry.

I have two, dual sized enclosed racks They are 19", but you can remove the doors and side panels, then turn it 90 degrees to use it as a 23" rack.

They are from some long gone National Semiconductor Datachecker POS systems that were scrapped 25 years ago.

?

On Sun, Nov 7, 2021 at 10:31 PM Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:

On 11/7/21 8:38 PM, Matt Huszagh wrote:
> I googled "HP test equipment rack" and the 19" rack popped up. I have
> seen these before, though I didn't know the term (or know that it was a
> standard). I also did not know that these are what HP, Agilent and
> Keysight use for their test equipment racks.

? ?Well, they followed the 19" rack standard.? Just like all of the
computer manufacturers (HP included) followed it too.

? ?The vernacular: One "rack U" (rack unit) is 1.75".? A "1U"
rack-mounted device is 1.75" tall, a "2U" chassis is 3.5", etc.? About
95% of the hardware you'll run across, test equipment and server-class
computers alike, is sized in these increments.? Soon you'll be able to
recognize them on sight and plan out your rack space allocations: "Oh, I
see that HP 3325A is a 3U box".? "Ah, I can put a 1U file server right
here".

? ?Look for a picture of the front one of these racks, empty, and look
at the holes facing you on the left and right.? Notice the spacing
pattern of the holes.? It looks irregular, but if you stare at it for a
moment you'll see that they're spaced out for 1.75" increments.

? ?All of this works amazingly well, and you will love it.

? ?This isn't just test equipment stuff.? If you haven't ever seen a
datacenter in person, surely you've seen pictures of them.? Those are
the same racks.

? ?Keyboardless synthesizers, signal processors, and amplifiers in
recording studios and on on concert stages...same racks.

? ?AT&T came up with this standard for telephony equipment in
1922...Yes, 99 years ago.

> I'm not sure if this is a good excuse but I'm relatively young (< 30)
> and only been doing electronics for the last couple years, when I
> started teaching myself. I also don't come from an engineering
> background, so I've probably missed some things that are evident to
> others in the field. I did study physics undergrad though, and research
> is one of the places I've come across these. But, none of us were too
> concerned that these were called 19" racks.

? ?It's not a good excuse. ;)? But it's never too late to catch up, and
you can fill in all of the knowledge blanks here.

? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

Hi Matt

You are correct that using a 4 post rack and shelves connecting 2 corners
gives added stability but a professional rack has side bracing as part of
the rack

Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Matt Huszagh
Sent: 08 November 2021 17:32
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP
Equipment

A number of people have mentioned stability without proper loading and
braces being a concern for these 4 post racks. It seems like using several
shelves that are each fastened to all 4 posts and then placing some gear on
there would provide this support to the shelf. Is that right?

Matt
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

Hi Matt

Thank you for the link but I personally would hold back from StarTech racks
as they do not seem to have an easy facility to put in side runners / side
supports

The big issue here is are you buying new or second hand or better being
given the rack
Secret hear is to let contractors know you are wanting racks my past
project I found a store of 20 + racks so had a field day and pinched all I
wanted
Suggest you look at old TV studios as the TV equipment has got smaller

There are 3 methods of putting in side supports / Runners

Method 1 Fix to the single row of cage nut holes back and front
Problem here is that these mountings can clash with the
equipment mounting holes in the equipment rack flanges / wings / ears
Method 2 these racks have an additional set of holes running vertical but
back from the front panel by approx. 1.5 inch so you do not actually use the
front vertical row of cage nut holes to mount the side runners / side
supports
Problem with both of the above is that you require side
runners / side supports the correct length to go with the cabinet

Method 3 these racks have an additional set of holes running vertical at
each corner but set at 90 degrees to the front panel
Advantages these are much easier to install equipment and reconfigure
You do not have to use all the same length runners
By drilling extra holes in the side runners / side
supports used in method 1 & 2 they can be used for method 3
Installing sliding trays tables and drawers is
much easier

I must admit that I possibly reconfigure 19 racks more than most as my
friend and I reconfigured 14 off 19inch racks earlier this year

Best suggestion is to design a bench lay out possibly including 19 racks and
be on the lookout while you build the bench
Please note they come in different depths and depending on the equipment but
providing you do not require a rear door the equipment can pultrude out of
the back

Regards Paul please note it appears that due to the time difference that
postings jump over each other so comments can be repeated

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Matt Huszagh
Sent: 08 November 2021 08:07
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP
Equipment

These 19" racks seem great. Thanks for pointing them out! I'm now
considering rack-mounting my equipment and delegating the shelf for other
purposes. Anyone have experience with StarTech? For example, this looks good


=pd_bxgy_img_1/139-5210024-5785621?pd_rd_w=pS3Uf&pf_rd_p=c64372fa-c41c-422e-
990d-9e034f73989b&pf_rd_r=19XT9T3DMF9D2CAGDQ9S&pd_rd_r=fb99773a-baf4-4742-a8
c4-55ba736f9601&pd_rd_wg=Zxnxo&pd_rd_i=B00HVKOPBW&th=1

There are also NavePoint options (which Dave mentioned), but are a tad more
expensive and have a lower rated weight capacity.

Matt
Re: Question: XY (XYZ or Vector) instrument CRT, replacement with an LCD ?

 

For all that, one might assume that reading the manual "might" give s clue..2 block diagrams from the manual showing whats being measured and how its being manipulated

On Monday, November 8, 2021, 8:48:14 AM PST, green <hrgerson@...> wrote:



hi,



Assuming that somewhere in the deflection amplifier signal chain, there might be some low voltage +/- 5V signals that could be used
? --- so that could then be fed into an LCD module ( such as the $55? STM32F746G-DISCO module ?).

?
thank you,
rick?

Note:
-- A number of Web references for vector XYZ type concepts have been discussed, including a well explained reference to a Patent, in the Tek Groups .io discussion:?
/g/TekScopes/topic/86718765
-- Not worried about the Tek 576 switch settings / plastic fiber display issues for now;? - those are simply a decode issue which can be easily solved and added to the converted LCD display, later on !?

576 block a.jpeg
576 block b.jpeg

Re: Question: XY (XYZ or Vector) instrument CRT, replacement with an LCD ?

 

Look at the schematics, the step amplifier for example. It shows 2v/div for the steps. Connect an instrument amplifier to the Steps Out and adjust the gain.
The deflection amplifiers are trickier but can be done with an instrumentation amplifier with proper scaling and offsets. You will need to protect the circuit from the 100 volt signals.
Good luck with the readout lamps for the ranges, but it is possible.?
Peter


On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 11:48 AM green <hrgerson@...> wrote:

hi,

Just to pull the conversation back to the?? *electronics*? of the replacement of a XYZ CRT with an LCD ??
???? { rather than the programming or software, for now }.

Does anyone have any technical expertise with? "picking off" ? the vector type (non-raster) CRT XYZ signals? (presumably from the low voltage deflection amplifiers)? ?

Assuming that somewhere in the deflection amplifier signal chain, there might be some low voltage +/- 5V signals that could be used
? --- so that could then be fed into an LCD module ( such as the $55? STM32F746G-DISCO module ?).

For this project question, the CRT display is a simple XYZ vector display, not a raster CRT:

The NewScope modules are too expensive to consider,
and this CRT issue is not concerned with longevity nor with hypothetical future replacements of the LCD with another LCD, etc.
Nor with the use of yet another CRT.

The point being that the STM LCD module may represent the possibility of actually capturing the data from, say a Tek 576 Curve Tracer( as an example), that would allow such data to be imported into a laptop for data manipulation, comparison? and file storage that could be useful for component R&D & project development, beyond the current instrument limitations.

The CRT's of these type of instruments are dying and are not easily replaceable.
Why not move forward with an inexpensive LCD module for these instruments ?

>>>? In any event, if anyone has direct technical experience with the type of XYZ CRT deflection signal pick-off and manipulation posed by this question, their experience or thoughts would be appreciated !
(i.e. , specifically for the Tek 576 CT,? would those signals have to be buffered or level shifted, etc. ?)

-- If anyone has come across a Website or a Blog conveying? *inexpensive*? vector XYZ CRT replacement ( or signal capture ) with an LCD,
I'd appreciate knowing about it !!
Not sure if there are other descriptions or jargon ( i.e.? " Scan Converter " etc. ) that might have been used to describe this sort of problem, perhaps published in "The Review of Scientific Instruments", or IEEE Transactions ?

There must have been sectors of the industry that encountered and solved this issue *inexpensively* ?
?
thank you,
rick?

Note:
-- A number of Web references for vector XYZ type concepts have been discussed, including a well explained reference to a Patent, in the Tek Groups .io discussion:?
/g/TekScopes/topic/86718765
-- Not worried about the Tek 576 switch settings / plastic fiber display issues for now;? - those are simply a decode issue which can be easily solved and added to the converted LCD display, later on !?

Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

Yes, in my experience with the Starcase racks, shelves that attach at all 4 corners to a lot to improve the stability.

On 11/8/21 12:31 PM, Matt Huszagh wrote:
A number of people have mentioned stability without proper loading and
braces being a concern for these 4 post racks. It seems like using
several shelves that are each fastened to all 4 posts and then placing
some gear on there would provide this support to the shelf. Is that
right?
Matt
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

Yes, it was 'Point Of Sale' hardware. I bought both minicomputers, ten in counter LASER scanners along with 14 cash registers and 14 printers. Two complete systems, from two stores..They threw in two chargers and an electric pallet jack, all for $100. I scraped the scanners for the LASER tubes and power supplies. I sold them for $400, and I got about $75 for the machined aluminum housings. The profits went to more equipment for the shop, at the Orlando Hamfest.

On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 11:48 AM Jim Ford <james.ford@...> wrote:
I take it POS stands for Point Of Sale, not Piece Of S***.? When I was in engineering school in the 1980s, we used the DEC Pro 350 computers, and they actually had an operating system called pOS!? Not a well thought out name!? ? ? ?Jim Ford?



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: "Michael A. Terrell" <terrell.michael.a@...>
Date: 11/8/21 12:33 AM (GMT-08:00)
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

There are also 23" wide racks that came from the Telco industry.
I have two, dual sized enclosed racks They are 19", but you can remove the doors and side panels, then turn it 90 degrees to use it as a 23" rack.
They are from some long gone National Semiconductor Datachecker POS systems that were scrapped 25 years ago.

On Sun, Nov 7, 2021 at 10:31 PM Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:
On 11/7/21 8:38 PM, Matt Huszagh wrote:
> I googled "HP test equipment rack" and the 19" rack popped up. I have
> seen these before, though I didn't know the term (or know that it was a
> standard). I also did not know that these are what HP, Agilent and
> Keysight use for their test equipment racks.

? ?Well, they followed the 19" rack standard.? Just like all of the
computer manufacturers (HP included) followed it too.

? ?The vernacular: One "rack U" (rack unit) is 1.75".? A "1U"
rack-mounted device is 1.75" tall, a "2U" chassis is 3.5", etc.? About
95% of the hardware you'll run across, test equipment and server-class
computers alike, is sized in these increments.? Soon you'll be able to
recognize them on sight and plan out your rack space allocations: "Oh, I
see that HP 3325A is a 3U box".? "Ah, I can put a 1U file server right
here".

? ?Look for a picture of the front one of these racks, empty, and look
at the holes facing you on the left and right.? Notice the spacing
pattern of the holes.? It looks irregular, but if you stare at it for a
moment you'll see that they're spaced out for 1.75" increments.

? ?All of this works amazingly well, and you will love it.

? ?This isn't just test equipment stuff.? If you haven't ever seen a
datacenter in person, surely you've seen pictures of them.? Those are
the same racks.

? ?Keyboardless synthesizers, signal processors, and amplifiers in
recording studios and on on concert stages...same racks.

? ?AT&T came up with this standard for telephony equipment in
1922...Yes, 99 years ago.

> I'm not sure if this is a good excuse but I'm relatively young (< 30)
> and only been doing electronics for the last couple years, when I
> started teaching myself. I also don't come from an engineering
> background, so I've probably missed some things that are evident to
> others in the field. I did study physics undergrad though, and research
> is one of the places I've come across these. But, none of us were too
> concerned that these were called 19" racks.

? ?It's not a good excuse. ;)? But it's never too late to catch up, and
you can fill in all of the knowledge blanks here.

? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

A number of people have mentioned stability without proper loading and
braces being a concern for these 4 post racks. It seems like using
several shelves that are each fastened to all 4 posts and then placing
some gear on there would provide this support to the shelf. Is that
right?

Matt
Re: Question: XY (XYZ or Vector) instrument CRT, replacement with an LCD ?

 

Hello, for me is one simple solution on the HP182T with dead CRT, I got ready X,Y output there is someone have put one 8 inch LCD display mods on X Y input?
Thank you.
Francesco

?
?
Sent:?Monday, November 08, 2021 at 4:48 PM
From:?"green" <hrgerson@...>
To:[email protected]
Subject:?Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Question: XY (XYZ or Vector) instrument CRT, replacement with an LCD ?

hi,

Just to pull the conversation back to the?? *electronics*? of the replacement of a XYZ CRT with an LCD ??
???? { rather than the programming or software, for now }.

Does anyone have any technical expertise with? "picking off" ? the vector type (non-raster) CRT XYZ signals? (presumably from the low voltage deflection amplifiers)? ?

Assuming that somewhere in the deflection amplifier signal chain, there might be some low voltage +/- 5V signals that could be used
? --- so that could then be fed into an LCD module ( such as the $55? STM32F746G-DISCO module ?).

For this project question, the CRT display is a simple XYZ vector display, not a raster CRT:

The NewScope modules are too expensive to consider,
and this CRT issue is not concerned with longevity nor with hypothetical future replacements of the LCD with another LCD, etc.
Nor with the use of yet another CRT.

The point being that the STM LCD module may represent the possibility of actually capturing the data from, say a Tek 576 Curve Tracer( as an example), that would allow such data to be imported into a laptop for data manipulation, comparison? and file storage that could be useful for component R&D & project development, beyond the current instrument limitations.

The CRT's of these type of instruments are dying and are not easily replaceable.
Why not move forward with an inexpensive LCD module for these instruments ?

>>>? In any event, if anyone has direct technical experience with the type of XYZ CRT deflection signal pick-off and manipulation posed by this question, their experience or thoughts would be appreciated !
(i.e. , specifically for the Tek 576 CT,? would those signals have to be buffered or level shifted, etc. ?)

-- If anyone has come across a Website or a Blog conveying? *inexpensive*? vector XYZ CRT replacement ( or signal capture ) with an LCD,
I'd appreciate knowing about it !!
Not sure if there are other descriptions or jargon ( i.e.? " Scan Converter " etc. ) that might have been used to describe this sort of problem, perhaps published in "The Review of Scientific Instruments", or IEEE Transactions ?

There must have been sectors of the industry that encountered and solved this issue *inexpensively* ?
?
thank you,
rick?

Note:
-- A number of Web references for vector XYZ type concepts have been discussed, including a well explained reference to a Patent, in the Tek Groups .io discussion:?
/g/TekScopes/topic/86718765
-- Not worried about the Tek 576 switch settings / plastic fiber display issues for now;? - those are simply a decode issue which can be easily solved and added to the converted LCD display, later on !?

Re: HP 412AR Leads

 


second photo shows that BNCs can be fit into the holes for the fixed leads....

Might be a nice practical improvement.
Re: HP 412AR Leads

 

Are they actually coaxial on the 412?? Wow, I didn't realize that. I stand corrected.

So, ok, the OP will need to get some coaxial cable rather than single-conductor silicone probe wire.

-Dave

On 11/8/21 11:53 AM, Bob Albert via groups.io wrote:
It's not that simple.? The leads are coaxial cables with terminations such that four wire resistance can be done.? The manual shows it but you will need some special cable.
Bob
On Monday, November 8, 2021, 08:28:31 AM PST, Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:
On 11/8/21 11:24 AM, JIM Rogers via groups.io wrote:
> I picked up a HP 412 AR and the leads were cut off. Where can I find
> replacements, or build them.
? The 412AR dates back to well over half a century ago; you will not
likely find "HP 412AR leads".? Your best bet is to get some nice
silicone-insulated wire and quality alligator clips and build a set of
leads.
? Decent silicone wire, amazingly from China, can be had via Amazon.
Look at the "BNTECHGO" brand; I've been very pleased with them. (and I'm
a quality snob)
? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 412AR Leads

Bob Albert
 

It's not that simple.? The leads are coaxial cables with terminations such that four wire resistance can be done.? The manual shows it but you will need some special cable.

Bob

On Monday, November 8, 2021, 08:28:31 AM PST, Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:


On 11/8/21 11:24 AM, JIM Rogers via groups.io wrote:
> I picked up a HP 412 AR and the leads were cut off. Where can I find
> replacements, or build them.

? The 412AR dates back to well over half a century ago; you will not
likely find "HP 412AR leads".? Your best bet is to get some nice
silicone-insulated wire and quality alligator clips and build a set of
leads.

? Decent silicone wire, amazingly from China, can be had via Amazon.
Look at the "BNTECHGO" brand; I've been very pleased with them. (and I'm
a quality snob)

? ? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I take it POS stands for Point Of Sale, not Piece Of S***.? When I was in engineering school in the 1980s, we used the DEC Pro 350 computers, and they actually had an operating system called pOS!? Not a well thought out name!? ? ? ?Jim Ford?



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: "Michael A. Terrell" <terrell.michael.a@...>
Date: 11/8/21 12:33 AM (GMT-08:00)
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

There are also 23" wide racks that came from the Telco industry.
I have two, dual sized enclosed racks They are 19", but you can remove the doors and side panels, then turn it 90 degrees to use it as a 23" rack.
They are from some long gone National Semiconductor Datachecker POS systems that were scrapped 25 years ago.

On Sun, Nov 7, 2021 at 10:31 PM Dave McGuire <mcguire@...> wrote:
On 11/7/21 8:38 PM, Matt Huszagh wrote:
> I googled "HP test equipment rack" and the 19" rack popped up. I have
> seen these before, though I didn't know the term (or know that it was a
> standard). I also did not know that these are what HP, Agilent and
> Keysight use for their test equipment racks.

? ?Well, they followed the 19" rack standard.? Just like all of the
computer manufacturers (HP included) followed it too.

? ?The vernacular: One "rack U" (rack unit) is 1.75".? A "1U"
rack-mounted device is 1.75" tall, a "2U" chassis is 3.5", etc.? About
95% of the hardware you'll run across, test equipment and server-class
computers alike, is sized in these increments.? Soon you'll be able to
recognize them on sight and plan out your rack space allocations: "Oh, I
see that HP 3325A is a 3U box".? "Ah, I can put a 1U file server right
here".

? ?Look for a picture of the front one of these racks, empty, and look
at the holes facing you on the left and right.? Notice the spacing
pattern of the holes.? It looks irregular, but if you stare at it for a
moment you'll see that they're spaced out for 1.75" increments.

? ?All of this works amazingly well, and you will love it.

? ?This isn't just test equipment stuff.? If you haven't ever seen a
datacenter in person, surely you've seen pictures of them.? Those are
the same racks.

? ?Keyboardless synthesizers, signal processors, and amplifiers in
recording studios and on on concert stages...same racks.

? ?AT&T came up with this standard for telephony equipment in
1922...Yes, 99 years ago.

> I'm not sure if this is a good excuse but I'm relatively young (< 30)
> and only been doing electronics for the last couple years, when I
> started teaching myself. I also don't come from an engineering
> background, so I've probably missed some things that are evident to
> others in the field. I did study physics undergrad though, and research
> is one of the places I've come across these. But, none of us were too
> concerned that these were called 19" racks.

? ?It's not a good excuse. ;)? But it's never too late to catch up, and
you can fill in all of the knowledge blanks here.

? ? ? ? ? ? -Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: Question: XY (XYZ or Vector) instrument CRT, replacement with an LCD ?

 


hi,

Just to pull the conversation back to the?? *electronics*? of the replacement of a XYZ CRT with an LCD ??
???? { rather than the programming or software, for now }.

Does anyone have any technical expertise with? "picking off" ? the vector type (non-raster) CRT XYZ signals? (presumably from the low voltage deflection amplifiers)? ?

Assuming that somewhere in the deflection amplifier signal chain, there might be some low voltage +/- 5V signals that could be used
? --- so that could then be fed into an LCD module ( such as the $55? STM32F746G-DISCO module ?).

For this project question, the CRT display is a simple XYZ vector display, not a raster CRT:

The NewScope modules are too expensive to consider,
and this CRT issue is not concerned with longevity nor with hypothetical future replacements of the LCD with another LCD, etc.
Nor with the use of yet another CRT.

The point being that the STM LCD module may represent the possibility of actually capturing the data from, say a Tek 576 Curve Tracer( as an example), that would allow such data to be imported into a laptop for data manipulation, comparison? and file storage that could be useful for component R&D & project development, beyond the current instrument limitations.

The CRT's of these type of instruments are dying and are not easily replaceable.
Why not move forward with an inexpensive LCD module for these instruments ?

>>>? In any event, if anyone has direct technical experience with the type of XYZ CRT deflection signal pick-off and manipulation posed by this question, their experience or thoughts would be appreciated !
(i.e. , specifically for the Tek 576 CT,? would those signals have to be buffered or level shifted, etc. ?)

-- If anyone has come across a Website or a Blog conveying? *inexpensive*? vector XYZ CRT replacement ( or signal capture ) with an LCD,
I'd appreciate knowing about it !!
Not sure if there are other descriptions or jargon ( i.e.? " Scan Converter " etc. ) that might have been used to describe this sort of problem, perhaps published in "The Review of Scientific Instruments", or IEEE Transactions ?

There must have been sectors of the industry that encountered and solved this issue *inexpensively* ?
?
thank you,
rick?

Note:
-- A number of Web references for vector XYZ type concepts have been discussed, including a well explained reference to a Patent, in the Tek Groups .io discussion:?
/g/TekScopes/topic/86718765
-- Not worried about the Tek 576 switch settings / plastic fiber display issues for now;? - those are simply a decode issue which can be easily solved and added to the converted LCD display, later on !?

Re: HP 412AR Leads

 

On 11/8/21 11:24 AM, JIM Rogers via groups.io wrote:
I picked up a HP 412 AR and the leads were cut off. Where can I find replacements, or build them.
The 412AR dates back to well over half a century ago; you will not likely find "HP 412AR leads". Your best bet is to get some nice silicone-insulated wire and quality alligator clips and build a set of leads.

Decent silicone wire, amazingly from China, can be had via Amazon. Look at the "BNTECHGO" brand; I've been very pleased with them. (and I'm a quality snob)

-Dave

--
Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
HP 412AR Leads

 

I picked up a HP 412 AR and the leads were cut off. Where can I find replacements, or build them.
Re: Question: XY (XYZ or Vector) instrument CRT, replacement with an LCD ?

 

On Sunday 07 November 2021 11:40:33 am peter bunge wrote:
It really soured me against Microsoft.
A lot of things have done that for me over the years. I have run nothing but linux since 1999, won't have anything to do with that company if it's at all possible...

--
Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and
ablest -- form of life in this section of space, ?a critter that can
be killed but can't be tamed. ?--Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters"
-
Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James
M Dakin
Re: Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

 

Hi Dave Just an acknowledgment and a bit more info for the new be

I was trying to be general and keep it simple as the person was only just introduced to 19 in racks
Agreed light units can be supported from the front panel only
Possibly an item up to I ft deep might be OK depending on how heavy
So a patch panel does not require supporting only the cables but I would consider a HP 8620 to heavy

Regarding the type of racks yes there are ones with threaded holes and they tend to have BA threads

Regarding Caged nutt they come in a variety of metric thread sizes and also BA

The cages are also designed for different metal thickness so it is important to know the problems when using the wrong size

Regarding Getting racks there are some very nice racks from server rooms that are replaced with smaller units unfortunately a lot are 6 ft or taller
But some of these are in kit form and can easily be shortened. Side covers can either be modified or simply not used

Regards Paul

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Dave McGuire
Sent: 08 November 2021 15:00
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Placing Shelf on Casters for HP Equipment

On 11/8/21 6:45 AM, Paul Bicknell wrote:
Equipment can have rack wings this allows the equipment to be bolted to the front of the 19 rack to prevent it moving ( NOT to Support it or hold it up )

*The equipment must be supported from front to back on shelves or side runners*
Supporting from those wings (commonly called "ears") is referred to as "cantilevered mounting". This is actually very common, acceptable, and the designers' intentions for many things.
You'd not mount, say, an HP 8566 that way, but many HP instruments are just fine with cantilevered mounting. Use judgement.

These will have square holes down both sides and this is where the cage nuts go as mentioned in an earlier mail
Note that not all holes are square; I found it to be about 50/50. There are square holes, round holes, and threaded round holes, all of which are common.

Dave McGuire, AK4HZ
New Kensington, PA
Re: HP 401 c VTVM

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Your body is a capacitor, charged to varying voltage as you move around.? Any sensitive meter will jump around as you approach or withdraw.

?

Dave Wise

?

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Askild via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2021 10:34 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP 401 c VTVM

?

Hi Mark,

?

Its normal for voltmeters with very high input impedance to not show stable 0V when probe is hanging free. Mine also jump around when touching the probe.?

The input impedance of the 410C is about 100MOhm, compared to most multimeters today that have 10MOhm.

?

To see if the voltmeter is showing 0V with no voltage applied, you need to short the voltmeter probe and the ground wire.

?

Regards,

Askild

?

?

On Mon, Nov 8, 2021 at 1:40 AM mjavit01 via <MJavit=[email protected]> wrote:

Hello one and all,
I have recently acquired a HP 410 C meter from a friend.
It works great measuring resistance. I do not have the AC probe that may have come with it, so I cannot attest to its AC measuring accuracy. However when I try to measure something as simple as a AAA or 9-volt battery the meter does something I am unable to explain.
The meter movement will not land or stay on zero when I turn the function switch to DC+ or DC-. I find that when I handle the DC probe it is when the meter goes crazy. (also technical term used in describing human behavior).
If I run my hand along the probe wire I get the same reaction.?
If I conduct the test with out letting the meter settle at zero I get a very accurate reading.
I have checked the internals of the probe and find that the center core of the coax is connected to the resistor which is connected to the tip.
The shield is cut back and covered with shrink tubing eliminating any possible "short"
I have checked the continuity of both the shield and the inner wire of the coax and there is nothing unusual to report.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

Respectfully

Mark

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