On Friday 21 June 2024 07:59:10 pm Jinxie via groups.io wrote: Nice to know I'm not the only person to use every single square inch of horizontal space to dump stuff. That's just the way things work, ain't it? Sure seems to be the case around here, anyway... -- Member of the toughest, meanest, deadliest, most unrelenting -- and ablest -- form of life in this section of space, ?a critter that can be killed but can't be tamed. ?--Robert A. Heinlein, "The Puppet Masters" - Information is more dangerous than cannon to a society ruled by lies. --James M Dakin
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Just use a Leo Bodnar precise reference locked to GPS into a FA-3 Frequency counter with OCXO Vectron oven. That thing is ultra stable and after a? tweak on receiving from new, its not moved after a few months? of use. Yes both are on 24hrs? a day.?
Very economical to get extreme accuracy.?
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Re: VISA problems with ancient test equipment?
Hi Ernst, yes, I received your last email, I will return an answer today with a link for modified program¡yesterday was too busy. ? Python 3.10.0 ? Yves ? ? Hello Yves,
thanks for the code. Looks pretty simple and understandable to me. Which version of python are you using?
Did you receive my email sent on thursday ? Otherwise please give me an alternative mail address. I desribed my experience with your latest program version.
Have a nice weekend.
Ernst
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Re: HP3048 data file format?
You should take a look at the KE5FX website as a starting point.
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The SRS PRS10 rubidium is substantially more expensive than the cheapest working rubidium frequency standards with working examples being 300-500USD rather than 50-150USD.
The PRS10 has very low close in phase noise.
A good use case is a very clean source for a signal generator or a phase noise measurement system.
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I'm consdering putting it up on Github, where others can help me? by offering generic numbers? they have used. I find some HP parts in the NSN system, but they are being dropped as the government retires models that use them. Many have a list of alternate parts, and limited data in the description.
I have a list of some Heathkit parts that were supplied to vocational electronics students. The parts accumulated at a local school from students that didn't finish the course. It's in HTML? It was on my old Earthlink websiite
Michael,
Your a real glutton for punishment...
I started out on a mission to make a parts cross reference for Heathkit parts.? I started out on my own 40 years ago with a little list based off equipment I owned. I added to it from time to time. A few years ago I decided to put some real effort into the most comprehensive cross reference list I could make.? I pulled all parts lists I could find from any source on the web. I searched dozens of repair forums, club write-ups, blogs, test equipment forums, ham radio forums, assembly manuals, circuit descriptions, and keyword searches through several search engines. Got a pretty good amount of varied info into a spreadsheet. Next was the hardest part, completing the part substitution work. It is pretty good after a couple of years work. But...
I seem to have hit an end point where I just cannot go any further. I think you may hit the same thing.
- Manufacturer part specs that were never scanned and cannot be found on the net.
- Paper specs and databooks that don't seem to exist anywhere.
- Part numbers that cannot be looked up, or are reused for other parts.
- Incomplete part numbers that defy guessing the prefixes.
- Parts that are just common names or simple descriptions (maybe not so bad for HP).
- Then there are parts that do substitute but are unobtainable and a second level substitution cannot be found.
I ran into lots of problems with the Heathkit list.? I should have started this spreadsheet 30 years ago. It may be easier for some parts of the HP list and things like the availability of some info on microfiche will help. Heath ran things pretty fast and loose. I think there will always be HP part numbers that don't have enough info to easily match. Close enough may work for a lot of parts. Just having an industry cross, even if not available will be helpful. Having been through one experience shows me the value of a comprehensive list and the difficulty of creating one.?
It would be good to get others to contribute and spread around the work, but I found it is very hard to get anyone interested.
I am currently trying to finish up the Data I/O Unisite family device support list (software revisions, footprints, device notes, adapters, etc.).? A mind numbing amount of work.? This may be the last time I take on one of these projects.
Good luck on your adventure. It is going to be a lot of work.
--
T. Gerbic
Central California
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For the vast majority of tasks, it really isn't necessary to have 'absolute' accuracy of the 10MHz reference. I still think that most users would be better off (most of the time) if they simply used a decent OCXO as a master reference if they need to lock two or more instruments together. I've done this in the past with vector sig gens and also when grabbing data from vector sig gens using an RTSA. In this case I use the reference from the RTSA as the master reference and connect it to the sig gen(s). This makes the captured IQ data look more 'conventional' as it won't have frequency offset errors baked into it.
It is generally a good idea to use a master OCXO that has low spurious and low phase noise. So something from a decent spectrum analyser or sig gen should be fine. Using a cheapo GPSDO is going to be risky. The Bodnar GPSDO doesn't appear to have good phase noise performance.? The Stanford Rb standard is better but still not anything special. It definitely doesn't qualify as 'excellent' in terms of spectral purity.
Also, sometimes it is useful (as in intuitive) to see cw signals with subtle frequency offsets beating together on an analyser. This can give insights into what contributes to a cw signal on an analyser. Part of it may come from a sig gen or from the DUT or maybe it is within the analyser itself.?
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Re: VISA problems with ancient test equipment?
Hello Yves,
thanks for the code. Looks pretty simple and understandable to me. Which version of python are you using?
Did you receive my email sent on thursday ? Otherwise please give me an alternative mail address. I desribed my experience with your latest program version.
Have a nice weekend.
Ernst
|
Jeff ¨C He should have said finite frontier ?. 73 ¨C Mike ? Mike B. Feher, N4FS 89 Arnold Blvd. Howell NJ 07731 908-902-3831 ?
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From: [email protected] < [email protected]> On Behalf Of Jeff Kruth via groups.io Sent: Friday, June 21, 2024 8:33 PM To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Frequency References ? Space is cubic in rectilinear format and I have filled every cubic inch. My favorite quote concerning my electronics hobby:"As Captain Kirk said 'Space, the final frontier'!"
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Years ago I took care of a scrapped HP 5065A, an old Rb standard with an Rb cavity that had a short circuit in the Tx cavity heater winding.
(a common problem). Repaired it and put it into service. Then, the rest of the instrument started to fall apart. I think I have replaced
a majority of all discrete semiconductor devices in it over the years.
At one moment, the repaired Rb cavity failed, this time an open circuit in the magnetic field winding.
I managed to find another scrapped 5065 where the cavity was intact. Inserted that one and after a few months it failed too.
Fixed that one and then went about to upgrade the photo cell input amplifier, improved the low voltage regulator,
copied an HP integrator update, etc. etc. (Some of the efforts can be found on KO4BB in the 5065A folder) .
When the electricity bills skyrocketed a few years ago and the local power company could not keep up with all power outages, I shut down the 5065A.
I think that no-one in the amateur radio community needs anything better than a good GPS diciplined quarz frequency reference.
I use a late model ?HP105B, a 5087A distribution (configured for 10MHz outputs) and a VE2ZAZ design for GPS control.
A Leo Bodnar would most likely be as good, less expenceive, taking up less space, consuming less AC power.
I do not recommend anyone spending all that energy trying to fix a 5065A unless using it for sentimental reasons.
It is like old vintage cars. They are not vehicles for transportation, they become never ending "projects".
Ulf - SM6GXV
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¦²¦Ö¦Å¦Ó: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] 8566B - Low signal on 2-22 GHz band
Hi Pete,? Sounds like a bad YIG mixer/filter assy, first thing I'd suggest to test for proper Hi band (2-22GHz) signal I/O through it, hope you have the proper service manual, a schematic and signal flow is very helpful. There are few replacements still selling on e-pay.?
Best and 73
¦²¦Ó¦É? ¦²?¦Â, 22 ¦©¦Ï¦Ô¦Í, 2024 ¦Ò¦Ó¦É? 4:31 ¦Ð.¦Ì., ¦Ï ¦Ö¦Ñ?¦Ò¦Ó¦Ç?W4PJB <petebibbyjr@...> ?¦Ã¦Ñ¦Á¦×¦Å: Hello All, this is my first post here. I recently acquired an HP 8566B with a some gremlins. I've replaced a few bad caps in the display section (one literally went up in smoke within 10 minutes of getting it home, another within 10 seconds after replacing the first one) and that's all working fine now.?
The low band works perfectly, as do all attenuator steps. But there is an issue with the high-band. The TLDR is this: Voltages in the power supply of the RF section seem good to within a few mV, except the floating 18V on the A18, which is 16.2 (the -10V side of that test pin is perfect to GND). The C4 and C19 on the A21 board are sketchy but measure good with an LCR meter out of circuit. I will need to order some as I have nothing close enough on hand, and "proper" wet tantalum caps are $40 each (I'll test with AL caps). I've tested the RF switch with another SA with TG (it's good), and the 1ST LO out is spot on 321.4 MHz + center frequency, amplitude is +5 dBm as expected.?
Finally, after days of thinking there was no signal on the high band, I input a 0 dBm, 3 GHz signal, set center frequency to 3 GHz, span to 10 kHz, slowed down the sweep time slow enough to watch, and set a peak marker to grab a measurement. Finally, I was able to detect an itty bitty peak about 4 dB above the noise floor, which is at about -97 dB at this bandwidth.?
And this is where I am now. I have no errors on the screen, just a very weak signal. If anyone has thoughts on where to go next, I'm all ears!?
Thanks!
-Pete W4PJB
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only space left is
where I walk, sleep, cook, eat and sit....even many of those are
crowded...I can not gain weight as the paths are narrow and my
work space needs clearing!
¸é±ð²Ô¨¦±ð
On 6/21/24 5:13 PM, Peter Gottlieb via
groups.io wrote:
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Horizontal
space?? I don't see any here.
On 6/21/2024 7:59 PM, Jinxie via groups.io wrote:
Nice to know I'm not the only person to
use every single square inch of horizontal space to dump stuff.
|
Michael,
Your a real glutton for punishment...
I started out on a mission to make a parts cross reference for Heathkit parts.? I started out on my own 40 years ago with a little list based off equipment I owned. I added to it from time to time. A few years ago I decided to put some real effort into the most comprehensive cross reference list I could make.? I pulled all parts lists I could find from any source on the web. I searched dozens of repair forums, club write-ups, blogs, test equipment forums, ham radio forums, assembly manuals, circuit descriptions, and keyword searches through several search engines. Got a pretty good amount of varied info into a spreadsheet. Next was the hardest part, completing the part substitution work. It is pretty good after a couple of years work. But...
I seem to have hit an end point where I just cannot go any further. I think you may hit the same thing.
- Manufacturer part specs that were never scanned and cannot be found on the net.
- Paper specs and databooks that don't seem to exist anywhere.
- Part numbers that cannot be looked up, or are reused for other parts.
- Incomplete part numbers that defy guessing the prefixes.
- Parts that are just common names or simple descriptions (maybe not so bad for HP).
- Then there are parts that do substitute but are unobtainable and a second level substitution cannot be found.
I ran into lots of problems with the Heathkit list.? I should have started this spreadsheet 30 years ago. It may be easier for some parts of the HP list and things like the availability of some info on microfiche will help. Heath ran things pretty fast and loose. I think there will always be HP part numbers that don't have enough info to easily match. Close enough may work for a lot of parts. Just having an industry cross, even if not available will be helpful. Having been through one experience shows me the value of a comprehensive list and the difficulty of creating one.?
It would be good to get others to contribute and spread around the work, but I found it is very hard to get anyone interested.
I am currently trying to finish up the Data I/O Unisite family device support list (software revisions, footprints, device notes, adapters, etc.).? A mind numbing amount of work.? This may be the last time I take on one of these projects.
Good luck on your adventure. It is going to be a lot of work.
--
T. Gerbic
Central California
|
Another factor is knowing your bench standard is basically correct. I don't "need" 1/1000 the accuracy of a GPSDO or Rb standard but do need to know those standards are locked on.? Both of those will do that whereas a crystal based timebase won't.? The extra accuracy comes as part of the deal.
Peter
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On 6/21/2024 11:08 PM, Greg Muir via groups.io wrote: Speaking of today¡¯s equipment prices on eBay, hardware I purchased a couple of decades ago for hundreds or less now sell in the thousands of $$. And it is still in operation and functioning well. I don¡¯t plan on selling any of it though because it is still in use.
Other:
Over the years I have joined groups similar to this one where the topic of precise frequency occasionally comes up. What I have found are people who have various associations in regards to it. These are:
1. Those who need it.
2. Those who are not really sure if they need it.
3. Those who have it for bragging rights.
Greg
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Speaking of today¡¯s equipment prices on eBay, hardware I purchased a couple of decades ago for hundreds or less now sell in the thousands of $$. And it is still in operation and functioning well. I don¡¯t plan on selling any of it though because it is still in use.
Other:
Over the years I have joined groups similar to this one where the topic of precise frequency occasionally comes up. What I have found are people who have various associations in regards to it. These are:
1. Those who need it.
2. Those who are not really sure if they need it.
3. Those who have it for bragging rights.
Greg
|
8566B - Low signal on 2-22 GHz band
Hello All, this is my first post here. I recently acquired an HP 8566B with a some gremlins. I've replaced a few bad caps in the display section (one literally went up in smoke within 10 minutes of getting it home, another within 10 seconds after replacing the first one) and that's all working fine now.?
The low band works perfectly, as do all attenuator steps. But there is an issue with the high-band. The TLDR is this: Voltages in the power supply of the RF section seem good to within a few mV, except the floating 18V on the A18, which is 16.2 (the -10V side of that test pin is perfect to GND). The C4 and C19 on the A21 board are sketchy but measure good with an LCR meter out of circuit. I will need to order some as I have nothing close enough on hand, and "proper" wet tantalum caps are $40 each (I'll test with AL caps). I've tested the RF switch with another SA with TG (it's good), and the 1ST LO out is spot on 321.4 MHz + center frequency, amplitude is +5 dBm as expected.?
Finally, after days of thinking there was no signal on the high band, I input a 0 dBm, 3 GHz signal, set center frequency to 3 GHz, span to 10 kHz, slowed down the sweep time slow enough to watch, and set a peak marker to grab a measurement. Finally, I was able to detect an itty bitty peak about 4 dB above the noise floor, which is at about -97 dB at this bandwidth.?
And this is where I am now. I have no errors on the screen, just a very weak signal. If anyone has thoughts on where to go next, I'm all ears!?
Thanks!
-Pete W4PJB
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Re: HP 3852a extended memory modules info
On 6/21/24 18:17, Maciej Kawalkowski wrote: have been made and 1 bodge wire is required. But it's working. Congratulations! Thanks for doing this. John
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Re: HP 3852a extended memory modules info
V0.1... all part of the process :)
Radu
On Fri, Jun 21, 2024, 5:17 PM Maciej Kawalkowski via <kawalkowski.m= [email protected]> wrote:   Mistakes have been made and 1 bodge wire is required. But it's working.?
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Space is cubic in rectilinear format and I have filled every cubic inch. My favorite quote concerning my electronics hobby:"As Captain Kirk said 'Space, the final frontier'!"
J Kruth
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Re: HP 3852a extended memory modules info
  Mistakes have been made and 1 bodge wire is required. But it's working.?
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maxwelloau
Michael A. Terrell