Re: N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
Hi
I think a sweep of 10 to 50 Ghz for a 3.5mm and a 2.92 compared to a 2.4 mm
would be moor useful to all and it would probably require 3 teats
10 to 20 ghz 22 to 40 ghz and 33 to 50 ghz
But who is equipped and up for it ?
suggest you use a 50 ghz power detector for all tests
verification of the test setup might be a problem
Paul
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected][mailto: [email protected]] On Behalf Of Reginald Beardsley via groups.io Sent: 29 April 2020 00:20 To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] N-Connectors at uW Frequencies I'd like to suggest sweeping a 3.5 or 2.48 mm to N-F adapter up to 26 GHz or above with a known good cable on each side, zero padding the data out 500 GHz and doing a transform to time. That will give ps resolution of the reflections at the cable to adapter interfaces. You can get femtosecond resolution by adding more zeros. Though at some point your sampling in frequency and accuracy will enter the picture if you push it too far. If someone posts data I'll be happy to kibbitz on the FFT. In the testing I've been doing using a Tek 11801 & SD-24, I've been pleasantly surprised at how little difference there was between Weinschel APC-7/3.5mm F and Chinese versions. I got very lucky and picked up 4 of the Weinschels new for less per piece than the 2 Chinese I bought just to test. The Weinschels are better, especially the APC-7 side. But they actually differ between assemblies. I had similar experience with some unmarked, but obviously high quality SS, APC-7/N-F bulkhead adapters. The TDR plots are here: msg3012344/#msg3012344 Note that this only goes to about 12 GHz because of the Chinese RG402 jumpers I used. But it should give a good idea of what your transform to time should look like. At this point I'm beginning to be more concerned about cable losses than connector quality. But I do test and verify. I should also note that I am not taking into account the rise time of the SD-24 pulse and head and cable BW as would be needed for precise work. I just want to get a general idea of how good or bad the cheap stuff is. I'll get to nit picking when my 8510C is installed and running in my screen room. After a bunch of really bad Chinese BNCs I've been quite happy with the rest. I think all of the devices I've culled via TDR have been BNCs including a bunch of Pomona attenuators which were simply worn out to the point of not being reliable. I would like to find cheap RG402 jumpers with less reflection at the SMA-M ends. These were the cheapest I could find on ebay. Gedas had asked me to try some and owed him more than one favor. They're not great, but not that bad either. The SD-24 step is 250 mV so you can calculate the RC & SWR from the photos. Have Fun! Reg ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18 Internal Virus Database is out of date.
|
Re: Velocity of propagation (so I can determine insertion delay) for a 3.5mm coax adapter?
Watch for a Harbor Freight sale flyer offering digital calipers for $10 and get one. Carefully file down the depth gauge tip so there is a 4 mm long segment at the end.
It has 0.05 mm resolution. I've not tested one against my grade B (50 millionths) gauge block set, but 0.5 mm seems a reasonable expectation of accuracy *if and only if* you take into account the coefficient of expansion of steel. Touching the caliper makes it expand much more than most people think. And temperature gets really gnarly and nasty if the materials are different.
Just don't leave the battery in it. Take it out when you're done as otherwise it will be dead the next time you try to use it. A ps one way is ~0.3 mm so you should be able to determine insertion length and velocity factor to better than needed accuracy.
I have the good fortune at almost 67 of being able to buy almost any T&M toy I want. Yesterday was an HP 4145B & 16058A test set. But I have very painful memories of when that was not the case. So my primary interest is T&M on a budget. I'm trying to show how to do more with less. My latest adventure is a $28 ebay noise source.
I'm quite impressed by the performance. Marketing, no. It's a 1 GHz source not a 2 GHz source and needs 10 V, not 12 V. But to go farther I'll have to learn how to calibrate and use my 8970B & 346B. That's awkward in my current lab space constraints.
Bug me directly if I happen to drop off the list for a while to get real work like my lab done. PMs via the mailing list seem to work best if I forget to check the SPAM bin.
Have Fun!
Reg
|
Re: N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
Here is an Agilent reply to a previous question on the same topic:
"Excellent question. N-type industry connectors generally work only up to 18 GHz, but still E4440A that goes up to 26.5 GHz has an N-type connector.
The concern is that a Type-N connector would introduce ¡°modes¡± in the Spectrum Analyzer frequency response. A ¡°mode¡± occurs when the Type-N connector structure becomes a weakly resonant cavity. This resonance would appear as a very narrow band ¡°suckout¡± in the connector insertion loss. This mode would presumably not be corrected by the Spectrum Analyzer flatness calibration.
Behind the Spectrum Analyzer front panel the internal cabling is 3.5 mm. The Type-N front panel connector is simply a Type-N (f) to 3.5 mm (f) adapter. So, any ¡°moding¡± would be attributable to the Type-N input adapter. Modes do not occur in Agilent Spectrum Anayzers for several reasons.
Advances in precision machining have allowed Type-N connectors to operate mode-free to 26.5 GHz. The PSA Type-N adapter shares many characteristics with the Agilent 1250-1745, Type-N (f) to 3.5 mm (f) adapter. Take for instance the Agilent 1250-1745 3.5 mm (f) to Type-N (f) adapter. The inner shield of the Type-N connector is solid. General purpose Type-N adapters (the Agilent 1250-1778 for instance) have a slotted inner shield. The slots allow for mechanical tolerance variations, however they create a non-uniform ground plane on the inner shield. The slots can lead to fringing of the E-field. These fringing effects impact connector performance.
Another area where Agilent has contributed to connector performance is in the center conductor support bead. Older Type-N adapters have Delron, or Teflon supporting the inner conductor. Looking into a general purpose Type-N adapter one can see a white dielectric surrounding the center conductor. The 1250-17XX family of Type-N adapters have a black support structure. This black support bead is an Agilent patented material that suppresses modes.
One simple test to look for modes can be done by mating an Agilent 1250-1744 (Type-N (m) to 3.5 mm (f)) and a 1250-1745 (Type-N (f) to 3.5 mm (f)). The insertion loss of the assembly can be measured with a network analyzer. The measurements should be made over a very narrow bandwidth stepping from 18 GHz to 26.5 GHz. Any modes will appear as a notch in the S21 response. Extensive testing on a PNA Network Analyzer with many connector combinations has shown the 1250-17XX family to be mode free."
|
Re: N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
I'd like to suggest sweeping a 3.5 or 2.48 mm to N-F adapter up to 26 GHz or above with a known good cable on each side, zero padding the data out 500 GHz and doing a transform to time. That will give ps resolution of the reflections at the cable to adapter interfaces. You can get femtosecond resolution by adding more zeros. Though at some point your sampling in frequency and accuracy will enter the picture if you push it too far.
If someone posts data I'll be happy to kibbitz on the FFT.
In the testing I've been doing using a Tek 11801 & SD-24, I've been pleasantly surprised at how little difference there was between Weinschel APC-7/3.5mm F and Chinese versions. I got very lucky and picked up 4 of the Weinschels new for less per piece than the 2 Chinese I bought just to test. The Weinschels are better, especially the APC-7 side. But they actually differ between assemblies. I had similar experience with some unmarked, but obviously high quality SS, APC-7/N-F bulkhead adapters.
The TDR plots are here:
Note that this only goes to about 12 GHz because of the Chinese RG402 jumpers I used. But it should give a good idea of what your transform to time should look like. At this point I'm beginning to be more concerned about cable losses than connector quality. But I do test and verify.
I should also note that I am not taking into account the rise time of the SD-24 pulse and head and cable BW as would be needed for precise work. I just want to get a general idea of how good or bad the cheap stuff is. I'll get to nit picking when my 8510C is installed and running in my screen room. After a bunch of really bad Chinese BNCs I've been quite happy with the rest. I think all of the devices I've culled via TDR have been BNCs including a bunch of Pomona attenuators which were simply worn out to the point of not being reliable.
I would like to find cheap RG402 jumpers with less reflection at the SMA-M ends. These were the cheapest I could find on ebay. Gedas had asked me to try some and owed him more than one favor. They're not great, but not that bad either. The SD-24 step is 250 mV so you can calculate the RC & SWR from the photos.
Have Fun!
Reg
|
Re: HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333
Hi Stuart
ALL HP instrument switch mode power supplies need a minimum load to operate correctly, most of the time, but not always, it is the +5VDC supply that needs loading. The +5VDC supply is rated at 4.5A so a minimum load would be say 3A. However you might find that additional loads on the other supply rails are needed.
Be very careful HP manufactured a number of power supplies based on the same basic design, but they are not always interchangeable.
Regards
George G6HIG On Tuesday, 28 April 2020, 23:13:21 BST, stur_mm via groups.io <stuart.ian.richardson@...> wrote:
Dave, ? J1 is open circuit and not under load, board is running standalone so not connected to anything. C322 replaced with new and not suspect. ? I have a donor comparison board although it¡¯s not identical from another SA not sure but need to check . May take a picture maybe someone can identify it so I can use as a straight swap. ? Maybe it needs to be connected to load not sure but checking voltages all are there but swinging about the rails. ? So: 5Volts ¨C 9-10volts both sides of toroid. 28.3volts ¨C Fixed but swinging between 42-46Volts on the non reg side. -15+15Volts ¨C 14-15volts ? Very odd. Is there some regulated or control that needs to be in place as a result of un connected cable, not sure.. ? Cheers, Stuart. ?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of David Speck
Sent: 28 April 2020 18:35
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333 ? Stu, A significant voltage drop across L301 suggests that there is a significant current drain downstream. This could be C322 gone leaky, or perhaps L 301 has partly failed and is showing a higher than normal resistance to a normal current drain.? How big is the voltage drop across L301? Can you measure the DC resistance of L301?? It should be fairly close to zero ohms.? Dave On 4/28/2020 1:18 PM, stur_mm via groups.io wrote: Peter et al, ? Plot thickens as testing all relevant test points shows that the PSU seems to be ¡°Hunting¡± as the 28.0volt is stable all other voltages are swinging up and down as much as 3volts really not sure what is going on. 28v stable as sourced from a supply voltage of 40Volts ? ? Peter, ? Hi, manage to find the time to get stuck in to replacing them . Before I take the plunge just done a quick offline check of voltages and found that all OK including the 28.3Volt supply rail but TP308 shows a very wobbly 8-9volts DC, should be +5Volts. Tried My other PSU board and rock solid at +5.0volt. Not sure on the TP308 +5V FL what does FL mean ? ? 
? L301 is a Toroid so not sure why there would be a differential across it? ? Both TP307 and 308 show same volts not +5v though.(Is this not some simple filtering? Somethings a miss somewhere. Any Guidance would be appreciative. ? Stu. ?
|
Re: HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333
Dave, ? J1 is open circuit and not under load, board is running standalone so not connected to anything. C322 replaced with new and not suspect. ? I have a donor comparison board although it¡¯s not identical from another SA not sure but need to check . May take a picture maybe someone can identify it so I can use as a straight swap. ? Maybe it needs to be connected to load not sure but checking voltages all are there but swinging about the rails. ? So: 5Volts ¨C 9-10volts both sides of toroid. 28.3volts ¨C Fixed but swinging between 42-46Volts on the non reg side. -15+15Volts ¨C 14-15volts ? Very odd. Is there some regulated or control that needs to be in place as a result of un connected cable, not sure.. ? Cheers, Stuart. ?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of David Speck
Sent: 28 April 2020 18:35
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333? Stu, A significant voltage drop across L301 suggests that there is a significant current drain downstream. This could be C322 gone leaky, or perhaps L 301 has partly failed and is showing a higher than normal resistance to a normal current drain.? How big is the voltage drop across L301? Can you measure the DC resistance of L301?? It should be fairly close to zero ohms.? Dave On 4/28/2020 1:18 PM, stur_mm via groups.io wrote: Peter et al, ? Plot thickens as testing all relevant test points shows that the PSU seems to be ¡°Hunting¡± as the 28.0volt is stable all other voltages are swinging up and down as much as 3volts really not sure what is going on. 28v stable as sourced from a supply voltage of 40Volts ? ? Peter, ? Hi, manage to find the time to get stuck in to replacing them . Before I take the plunge just done a quick offline check of voltages and found that all OK including the 28.3Volt supply rail but TP308 shows a very wobbly 8-9volts DC, should be +5Volts. Tried My other PSU board and rock solid at +5.0volt. Not sure on the TP308 +5V FL what does FL mean ? ? 
? L301 is a Toroid so not sure why there would be a differential across it? ? Both TP307 and 308 show same volts not +5v though.(Is this not some simple filtering? Somethings a miss somewhere. Any Guidance would be appreciative. ? Stu. ?
|
Re: Velocity of propagation (so I can determine insertion delay) for a 3.5mm coax adapter?
Reg - thanks - I was looking for this to be a learning experience, you certainly didn't disappoint! Whether I can pull off the required research is another matter...
As for the insertion length - the setback measurement will require a procedure itself (I doubt my $2 tire depth gauge would do the trick give it's 1mm resolution, but it would be better than nothing.)
Is it practical to start from the diameters of a 50-ohm 3.5mm air line (the adapter seems like an air line except for a bead in the middle to support the center conductor) to ascertain the velocity of propagation?
Anyway, thanks again Reg for the quick and interesting reply! I'm hoping (for hobby-level work) that I can work forward from physical measurements to derive expected insertion delay.
Dave
|
Re: Velocity of propagation (so I can determine insertion delay) for a 3.5mm coax adapter?
How are you measuring the length? Do you have a micrometer with spindles which will contact the female connectors? Those form the reference plane.
Using a dial caliper on a Chinese SMA F-F bulkhead connector I measure the overall length as 22.5 mm. The setback of the center conductor from the outer shield is 2.1 - 2.2 mm at each end measured using the depth probe on the caliper. So that gives an insertion length of 18.1 - 18.3 mm.
What does it look like in the time domain? You should see a bump at each end of the adapter going into a load or well matched transmission line. I play with TDR using a Tek 11801 & SD-24 quite a lot. There's a thread here:
I would not trust the TDR software for a VNA after reading Dunsmore's presentation of the subject. A much better approach is to load the data into a PC and use Octave to transform to time. Zero pad the data up to 500 GHz to get 1 ps resolution in the transform and taper the values at the high end. Don't just truncate it as that will produce ringing in the time domain. The amount of ringing is the product in time of the sinc(flat_bw) * sinc(taper_bw). In frequency the spectrum after applying a taper is the convolution of two boxcars, a long one and a short one which is the taper. You will get somewhat better results if you apply a raised cosine taper, but the dominant factor is the ratio of the flat part of the spectrum to the taper.
The spacing of the samples in frequency determines the length of the time series. The length of the frequency series determines the sampling in time. It's exactly like going from time to frequency.
The VNA just collects positive frequencies, so you need to pad the second half of the series with the complex conjugate of the positive frequencies in reversed order. Nyquist is in the center and the lowest frequencies are at the ends with DC being the first value in the series.
I hope I've not muddied the waters. The EE community describes the transform rather differently than in the reflection seismic community. I'm used to doing the transformation from EE jargon to geophysics jargon, but less so going the other way.
Reg
|
Re: fluke 6080A signal generator
Hi when I bought my Fluke 6060 a long time
ago it had an intermittent fault? on the RF output level
?
I tracked it down by going through the attenuate
and final RF amplifier and repaired 3 dry joints?
I just set it to a low frequency and ran up
the line with a scope probe
?
Best of luck? lovely sig gen when it
works ??
?
Paul
?
?
Hello,
This is not the group to post but a quesrtion :
I've got a fluke 6080A signal generator [ -140dbm-?+20dBm,
10khz..1056 MHz] which doesn't produce any outpurt and had problems with its
attenuator which is switched with small rf teledyne relais.
Anyone expierience in this group with repairing this kind of very solid
build generator with this symtoms?
any help would be apreciated
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG -
Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18
Internal Virus Database is out of date.
|
Re: HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333
Hi
You need to draw at least 3A from the +5VDC before the supply will become stable
George G6HIG
On Tuesday, 28 April 2020, 22:34:27 BST, Peter Hansen <oz1lpr@...> wrote:
Hello Stu did you measure both psu unconnected ?. I might be the regulator does not like no load ?
Peter et al, ? Plot thickens as testing all relevant test points shows that the PSU seems to be ¡°Hunting¡± as the 28.0volt is stable all other voltages are swinging up and down as much as 3volts really not sure what is going on. 28v stable as sourced from a supply voltage of 40Volts ?
From: [email protected] <[email protected]>On Behalf Of stur_mm via groups.io
Sent: 28 April 2020 15:14
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333? Peter, ? Hi, manage to find the time to get stuck in to replacing them . Before I take the plunge just done a quick offline check of voltages and found that all OK including the 28.3Volt supply rail but TP308 shows a very wobbly 8-9volts DC, should be +5Volts. Tried My other PSU board and rock solid at +5.0volt. Not sure on the TP308 +5V FL what does FL mean ? ? 
? L301 is a Toroid so not sure why there would be a differential across it? ? Both TP307 and 308 show same volts not +5v though.(Is this not some simple filtering? Somethings a miss somewhere. Any Guidance would be appreciative. ? Stu. ? ? Hello Stu I use what I can get my hands on. That is often panasonic or nippon. but in fact all NON china will do ok. The reason why I said 220uF is because it is hard to find 180uF at least in my junk box?. the caps you shoe is really bad. change them and you have your analyzer back?
Peter, etal ? Decided they all were suspicious and with great care removed. Spot the suspect cap for 28.8volt supply? ? What¡¯s the best manufacturer for Electrolytics, 180/220uF(Know you suggested 220uF) going to order some today from RS components.. ? That was the suspicious odour that came from the analyser I guess.. ? Remove them with great care, including the 12v 470uF cap, decision after seeing the darkened appearance and bulging bottom of the cap. No vias were removed at the same time just lots of Heat and Flux, braid and they came out easily. (Pictures may look like via¡¯s still attached to legs, but it¡¯s solder! ? Cheers, Stu. ? 
? ? ? ? ? ? ? Hi,
I used Chipquick to remove a broken ADC from my TDS540B acquisition board and from a donor board.
Worked great.
I added Chipquick to all the joints and heated the whole chip using hot air to remove it.
Afterwards I cleaned the soldering pads using a normal iron and flux.
Putting the donor part back was done using a normal, small flat soldering iron.
Pictures can be found here:
/g/TekScopes/album?id=21745
|
Re: HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333
Hello Stu did you measure both psu unconnected ?. I might be the regulator does not like no load ?
Peter et al,
?
Plot thickens as testing all relevant test points shows that the PSU seems to be ¡°Hunting¡± as the 28.0volt is stable all other voltages are swinging up and down as much as 3volts really not sure what is going on.
28v stable as sourced from a supply voltage of 40Volts
?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
From: [email protected] <[email protected]>
On Behalf Of stur_mm via groups.io
Sent: 28 April 2020 15:14
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] HP8562A Errors 304,335,317,333
?
Peter,
?
Hi, manage to find the time to get stuck in to replacing them .
Before I take the plunge just done a quick offline check of voltages and found that all OK including the 28.3Volt supply rail but TP308 shows a very wobbly 8-9volts DC, should be +5Volts.
Tried My other PSU board and rock solid at +5.0volt. Not sure on the TP308 +5V FL what does FL mean ?
?
?
L301 is a Toroid so not sure why there would be a differential across it?
?
Both TP307 and 308 show same volts not +5v though.(Is this not some simple filtering?
Somethings a miss somewhere.
Any Guidance would be appreciative.
?
Stu.
?
?
Hello Stu I use what I can get my hands on. That is often panasonic or nippon. but in fact all NON china will do ok. The reason why I said 220uF is because it is hard to find 180uF at least in my junk box
?.
the caps you shoe is really bad. change them and you have your analyzer back
?
Peter, etal
?
Decided they all were suspicious and with great care removed.
Spot the suspect cap for 28.8volt supply?
?
What¡¯s the best manufacturer for Electrolytics, 180/220uF(Know you suggested 220uF) going to order some today from RS components..
?
That was the suspicious odour that came from the analyser I guess..
?
Remove them with great care, including the 12v 470uF cap, decision after seeing the darkened appearance and bulging bottom of the cap.
No vias were removed at the same time just lots of Heat and Flux, braid and they came out easily. (Pictures may look like via¡¯s still attached to legs, but it¡¯s solder!
?
Cheers,
Stu.
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
Hi,
I used Chipquick to remove a broken ADC from my TDS540B acquisition board and from a donor board.
Worked great.
I added Chipquick to all the joints and heated the whole chip using hot air to remove it.
Afterwards I cleaned the soldering pads using a normal iron and flux.
Putting the donor part back was done using a normal, small flat soldering iron.
Pictures can be found here:
/g/TekScopes/album?id=21745
|
fluke 6080A signal generator
Hello,
This is not the group to post but a quesrtion : I've got a fluke 6080A signal generator [ -140dbm-?+20dBm, 10khz..1056 MHz] which doesn't produce any outpurt and had problems with its attenuator which is switched with small rf teledyne relais. Anyone expierience in this group with repairing this kind of very solid build generator with this symtoms?
any help would be apreciated
regards jac pe1kxh?
|
Re: N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
I ran into this question some time back, and found the following:
The posting has seemed to move around within the keysight web pages from time to time, but a search for "A Signal Analyzer Connector Puzzler" should get to the document.
It appears the trade-off is related to mechanical robustness of N connectors.
|
Hello group! Anyone ever work on these? I have one that I am working on but having issues. #1, it says it's model 8709A on the front, but the manual for the 8709B appears closer. That is not helping. Initially it did not work at all... power rails off. I replaced a shorted zener and an open (!) transistor in the -20V supply and that got it working... sort of. This unit has an "inverting output amp" (from the "B" manual - not in the "A" manual) but when that is attached, the power rails are bad again. (it has one op-amp on it, so it's most likely bad. But worrying about that later. Disconnected for now) It's quite difficult to adjust the power rails for proper +/- 20V. Somewhat interactive (?) and they vary depending on the state of the instrument. (for example if I have an RF signal at the input or not) From 20V w/RF down to about 16V w/o it. This fluctuation also affects the 20.278 MHz oscillator frequency. (w/o RF input it measures about 17 MHz and unstable) So, if I input 20.278 MHz and adjust the oscillator for 20.278 MHz, the "unlock" light flashes at about a 0.5 Hz rate, and the output error voltage is swinging up/down along with it. Basically I cannot get it to lock. I suspect the power supply is still not quite right OR something is tugging on it such that it goes into current limit. The +20V rail is the worst. I might try an external supply but not easily done with this old beast. I should also as a matter of course check/replace electrolytics... Thoughts and suggestions welcome! Mark 
|
I have an 8648C that I bought second hand, great Sig Gen. Yesterday I got in
a new Siglent SSA3021X Spectrum Analyzer.
I decided to run some tests on both. If I set the 8648c to -20dBm, I see -20.57
dBm on the Siglent, not that much to worry about.
If I reduce the level on the 8648C to -80dBm, the value on the Siglent is around
-80 dBm, but it fluctuates +/- a Db or so. Now, -80dBm = 22.4uV at 50 ohms.
If I set the 8648C to 22.4 uVemf, the Siglent reads around 10 uV ?? Switching the
Siglent to read dBm, I get around -87 dBm.
The Siglent seems consistent, but the 8648C seems to have an issue switching
between dBm and uVemf.
I expect this is a cockpit error, so I am here to ask for some clarity.
Thanks for your assistance,
73, Dick, W1KSZ
|
Re: Are there any HP CRT refrenece documents?
Hi Toby
Thank you for the CRT Part number you posted
I have updated the CRT list with missing information that you have provided
the file is in the Clipboard
Best Regards Paul
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected][mailto: [email protected]] On Behalf Of Toby Sent: 28 April 2020 15:05 To: [email protected]Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] Are there any HP CRT refrenece documents? On 2020-04-27 2:50 PM, Jeremy Nichols wrote: Here is a list I have compiled. It is nowhere near complete; I hope it
is correct.
I've found that the installed part number can be different from the one specified in the service manual parts list or as options. Having "source" listed in such a list could be interesting. (e.g. "seen installed", "service manual", "not listed but tested ok", or option number). --Toby Jeremy
HP CRTs
G-205E-2 ?175A Oscilloscope (P31)
The following all carry the first four digits "5083-"
0353 130C Oscilloscope
0722 132A Oscilloscope (dual gun)
0652 140A Oscilloscope
9093 140T Oscilloscope
1452 141A Storage Oscilloscope
2587 141T Storage Oscilloscope
2511 141T Storage Oscilloscope
1752 143A Oscilloscope (P31)
1722 143A Oscilloscope (P2)
1751 143A Oscilloscope (P?)
1732 143A Oscilloscope (P7)
1442 143A Oscilloscope (P11)
0842 H30-175A Oscilloscope, high writing-rate CRT
3552 1740A Oscilloscope
5070 1741A Storage Oscilloscope
9023 180E Oscilloscope
1952 181T Storage Oscilloscope
5791 8510 Network Analyzer
3975 Unknown, seen for sale on eBay
1875 Unknown, eBay rectangular
6589 Unknown, eBay rectangular
5732 Unknown, eBay rectangular
6577 Unknown, eBay rectangular
5751 Unknown, eBay rectangular
5723 Unknown, eBay rectangular
On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 11:08 AM walter shawlee <walter2@...
<mailto:walter2@...>> wrote:
With Tektronix, there is both a detailed CRT data dump, and a "used
in" index for CRTs, but I have never found anything similar for HP.?
does anyone know of any hp CRT reference data out there?? any info
appreciated, as I have failed to find any for 30+ years. It seems
like it must exist but I just don't know how to fin dit.
best regards,
walter (walter2 -at- sphere.bc.ca <>)
sphere research corp.
----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18 Internal Virus Database is out of date.
|
Re: N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
Take a look on E-bay for HP precision N to SMA bulkheAD CONNECTORS. i'VE BOUGHT THEM FOR AS LITTLE AS $10.00. Someone recently commented that the SWR input to the counter was about 4:1 - at that point, the connector may not be the dominant effect. Cheers! Quoting Paul Bicknell <paul@...>:
Hi
From memory the Ebay price is the same as I was quoted as new several years
ago
I was thinking of them as an alternative to a replacement for broken APC
3.5 on the front of HP test equipment
Best Regards Paul
_____
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of DF6NA Rainer
Sent: 28 April 2020 21:24
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
Hi Paul,
the prices are shocking !
dapters-pair-TWO-PIECES/223960329767?hash=item3425136e27:g:Qj8AAOSweJxdkyDg
I have seen some used in high quality test equipment and I believe them to
be very good.
73, Rainer
Am 28.04.2020 um 21:47 schrieb Paul Bicknell:
Hi Rainer
In the past I have looked at Aeroflex Planar Crown but cannot remember how
good they are compared to a APC 3.5 or a 2.92 connector
Do you have any practical experience in using them also approximate cost
of bulkhead and adapters each side to APC 3.5
Regards Paul
_____
From: <mailto:[email protected]>
[email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of DF6NA Rainer
Sent: 28 April 2020 17:15
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [HP-Agilent-Keysight-equipment] N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
Hi Gedas,
N connectors will work above 20GHz but are not reliable. I use my 8563A with
N connector also up to 26.5GHz.
But I recently changed the N connector on my 5350B to Aeroflex Planar Crown.
So I can have N / SMA / APC3.5 or even APC2.92
on the input. HP has N connectors on the 5350B, APC3.5 on 5351B and APC2.4
on 5352B.
73, Rainer
Am 28.04.2020 um 16:54 schrieb Gedas:
I am evaluating an Agilent E4408B SA for a friend which goes to 26.5 GHz.
The RF input connector is a female N-connector.
Are there some N-connectors that will operate that high or is the connector
Agilent using on this TE (and others) a compromise above 18GHz-20 GHz?
Gedas, W8BYA EN70JT
Gallery at
Light travels faster than sound....
This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
On 4/28/2020 2:52 AM, DF6NA Rainer wrote:
Hi,
that's what you are looking for. The N connector is good to 20GHz. The
APC3.5 is needed for up to 26.5GHz.
73, Rainer
Am 28.04.2020 um 02:00 schrieb John Gord via groups.io:
Jim,
Could you provide a close-up photo of the damaged connector?
--John Gord
On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 09:50 AM, Jim Potter wrote:
The high-frequency input connector on an HP 5351B I just purchased appears
to be missing the input connector. I believe it was an APC-3.5. There
appears to be a missing insert. I'm looking for tips on how to repair or
replace this connector. For my purpose a type N connector would be
acceptable as a replacement. I have the service manual. It looks like there
is a cable assembly. One part number for the APC-3.5 and one for the type N.
Thanks, Jim
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com <>
Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18
Internal Virus Database is out of date.
|
Velocity of propagation (so I can determine insertion delay) for a 3.5mm coax adapter?
I'm trying to work out relationship of insertion delay (as measured with VNA in picoseconds) and insertion length (as might be specified for a device, in millimeters). My goal is to determine the insertion delay (picoseconds) of an adapter where no specifications seem to exist.
In this case, the "device under test" is one of those female-to-female 3.5mm bulkhead panel adapters that seem to be pulls from a variety of HP microwave test equipment (they show up on ebay frequently.) There are no specs that I'm aware of for the part. The physical length is ~30.9 mm (my measurement). The insertion length (presumably based on knowing the reference plane) is not known to me at this point. The insertion delay is the unknown I'm interested in finding.
All searches on this so far have turned up nothing, and Joel Dunsmore's book doesn't seem to discuss the topic (at least I've not found the needed paragraph yet.) My goal is to be able to use the bulkhead adapter in VNA measurements (I'd prefer to have "real" characterized adapter such as HP 83059B or other) but that is not in my parts bin, and the bulkhead adapter is.
When measuring delay (on HP 8753) I get a delay in picoseconds (round-trip delay, because I'm inserting the adapter into the reflection signal path.) Te one-way delay (half of round trip) was measured as 93 pSec. If I convert insertion delay (one-way) in pSec to mm using velocity of propagation of 1 (full speed of light) I get an insertion length of 27.93 mm.This seems plausible (given the physical length of the adapter is 30.9 mm), but I think assuming velocity of propagation of 1.0 is improper, as the signal is propagating in something other than a vacuum. As the adapter is 3.5mm type, there is mostly air dielectric (save for a small internal disc).
Any advice, pointers, or suggestions as to how I can proceed, or where I can go to learn about this (which is basically why I'm doing this!)
Thanks very much,
Dave
wb0gaz@...
|
Hello,
This email message is a notification to let you know that the following files have been uploaded to the Files area of the [email protected]
group.
Uploaded By:
Paul Bicknell <paul@...>
Description:
latest CRT Parts number list
Cheers,
The Groups.io Team
|
Re: N-Connectors at uW Frequencies
Hi
?
From memory the Ebay price is the same as I
was quoted as new several years ago
?
I was thinking of them as an alternative to
a replacement for broken? APC 3.5 on the front of HP test equipment
?
Best Regards Paul
?
Hi Paul,
the prices are shocking !
I have seen some used in high quality test equipment and I believe them to be
very good.
73, Rainer
Am 28.04.2020 um 21:47 schrieb Paul Bicknell:
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Hi Rainer
?
In the past I have looked at Aeroflex Planar Crown but cannot remember
how good they are compared to a? APC 3.5? or a? 2.92
connector??
Do you have any practical experience in
using them? also approximate cost? of bulkhead and adapters each side
to? APC 3.5
?
Regards Paul
?
?
Hi Gedas,
N connectors will work above 20GHz but are not reliable. I use my 8563A with N
connector also up to 26.5GHz.
But I recently changed the N connector on my 5350B to Aeroflex Planar Crown. So
I can have N / SMA / APC3.5 or even APC2.92
on the input. HP has N connectors on the 5350B, APC3.5 on 5351B and APC2.4 on
5352B.
73, Rainer
Am 28.04.2020 um 16:54 schrieb Gedas:
I
am evaluating an Agilent E4408B SA for a friend which goes to 26.5 GHz. The RF
input connector is a female N-connector.
Are
there some N-connectors that will operate that high or is the connector Agilent
using on this TE (and others) a compromise above 18GHz-20 GHz?
Gedas, W8BYA EN70JT ? Gallery at Light travels faster than sound.... This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
On 4/28/2020 2:52 AM, DF6NA Rainer wrote:
Hi,
that's what you are looking for. The N connector is good to 20GHz.? The
APC3.5 is needed for up to 26.5GHz.
73, Rainer
Am 28.04.2020 um 02:00 schrieb John Gord via groups.io:
Jim,
Could you provide? a close-up photo of the damaged connector?
--John Gord
On Mon, Apr 27, 2020 at 09:50 AM, Jim Potter wrote:
The high-frequency
input connector on an HP 5351B I just purchased appears to be missing the input
connector. I believe it was an APC-3.5. There appears to be a missing insert.
I'm looking for tips on how to repair or replace this connector. For my purpose
a type N connector would be acceptable as a replacement. I have the service
manual. It looks like there is a cable assembly. One part number for the
APC-3.5 and one for the type N.
Thanks, Jim
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG -
Version: 2016.0.8048 / Virus Database: 4793/15886 - Release Date: 08/14/18
Internal Virus Database is out of date.
?
|
Paul Bicknell