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Hello all, I just recently upgraded to the latest Gemini.net driver, as well as turned on RA/DEC 4x Step Res. I am at L6.12 on the G2
On my very next session, I was not able to accurately plate solve. The target would stay to the right, just at the edge of the FOV. NINA (PS3) would stop solving at 1' .08" or 0.52" which I thought odd that it was basically solving at 1' +/- .08".
I checked my time and it is correct and set for UTC. I did not turn off the 4x Step Res option, but plan to try that tomorrow (Monday) night when it is clear again. Is this possibly the cause? Or, am I missing something more obvious. I used to be able to solve down to a few seconds, with the target perfectly centered.
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Thanks!
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Art
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Try the precession setting in Gemini.NET. You may need to change it (check or uncheck):
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On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 01:38 PM, Art Trail wrote:
Hello all, I just recently upgraded to the latest Gemini.net driver, as well as turned on RA/DEC 4x Step Res. I am at L6.12 on the G2
On my very next session, I was not able to accurately plate solve. The target would stay to the right, just at the edge of the FOV. NINA (PS3) would stop solving at 1' .08" or 0.52" which I thought odd that it was basically solving at 1' +/- .08".
I checked my time and it is correct and set for UTC. I did not turn off the 4x Step Res option, but plan to try that tomorrow (Monday) night when it is clear again. Is this possibly the cause? Or, am I missing something more obvious. I used to be able to solve down to a few seconds, with the target perfectly centered.
?
Thanks!
?
Art
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Paul, that is checked. As it used to be. I would think that it should stay that way? Or am I wrong.
"Gemini Calculate Refraction" in also checked. Is that OK?
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Thanks,
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Art
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On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 03:04 PM, Art Trail wrote:
Paul, that is checked. As it used to be. I would think that it should stay that way? Or am I wrong.
"Gemini Calculate Refraction" in also checked. Is that OK?
?
Thanks,
?
Art
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There's no way for me to tell if that's right or wrong for your setup, as it depends on the mix of software and drivers and all of their individual configurations. Since the error sounds within the bounds of what a J2000 to JNow precession calculation might produce, try unchecking it and see if it solves the problem. "Gemini calculates refraction" is also usually OK, but this will not cause a 1 arcminute error, especially if you're pointing 15-20 degrees above the horizon. That setting also depends on whether your software already calculates refraction in the coordinates sent to Gemini. If that's the case, you'll want to turn off that setting, also.
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Ok. I¡¯ll give it a shot. How about ¡°flip on goto¡±? Is that a good one to have enabled?
On Sunday, May 11, 2025, 3:44 PM, Paul Kanevsky <yh@...> wrote: On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 03:04 PM, Art Trail wrote:
Paul, that is checked. As it used to be. I would think that it should stay that way? Or am I wrong.
"Gemini Calculate Refraction" in also checked. Is that OK?
?
Thanks,
?
Art
?
There's no way for me to tell if that's right or wrong for your setup, as it depends on the mix of software and drivers and all of their individual configurations. Since the error sounds within the bounds of what a J2000 to JNow precession calculation might produce, try unchecking it and see if it solves the problem. "Gemini calculates refraction" is also usually OK, but this will not cause a 1 arcminute error, especially if you're pointing 15-20 degrees above the horizon. That setting also depends on whether your software already calculates refraction in the coordinates sent to Gemini. If that's the case, you'll want to turn off that setting, also.
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On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 05:04 PM, Art Trail wrote:
How about ¡°flip on goto¡±? Is that a good one to have enabled?
If you're having issues with automated meridian flips, then it might be worth trying. This has no effect on plate solving or pointing accuracy.
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Thanks for your help, Paul.
On Sunday, May 11, 2025, 4:10 PM, Paul Kanevsky <yh@...> wrote: On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 05:04 PM, Art Trail wrote:
How about ¡°flip on goto¡±? Is that a good one to have enabled?
If you're having issues with automated meridian flips, then it might be worth trying. This has no effect on plate solving or pointing accuracy.
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On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 10:38 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Hello all, I just recently upgraded to the latest Gemini.net driver, as well as turned on RA/DEC 4x Step Res. I am at L6.12 on the G2
On my very next session, I was not able to accurately plate solve. The target would stay to the right, just at the edge of the FOV. NINA (PS3) would stop solving at 1' .08" or 0.52" which I thought odd that it was basically solving at 1' +/- .08".
I checked my time and it is correct and set for UTC. I did not turn off the 4x Step Res option, but plan to try that tomorrow (Monday) night when it is clear again. Is this possibly the cause? Or, am I missing something more obvious. I used to be able to solve down to a few seconds, with the target perfectly centered.
?
Thanks!
?
Art
?
This is not a Gemini 2 issues so much as one of your apps is pushing setting data or pulling setting data from elsewhere in the system.? Several other N.I.N.A. users here have reported various issues after updating their Gemini 2 L6 system which was resolved after fixing their settings.? So it is most likely that you have a configuration issue with one or more of your PC apps.?
?
--
Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
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Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
On Sunday, May 11, 2025, 11:41 PM, Chip Louie via groups.io <chiplouie@...> wrote: On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 10:38 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Hello all, I just recently upgraded to the latest Gemini.net driver, as well as turned on RA/DEC 4x Step Res. I am at L6.12 on the G2
On my very next session, I was not able to accurately plate solve. The target would stay to the right, just at the edge of the FOV. NINA (PS3) would stop solving at 1' .08" or 0.52" which I thought odd that it was basically solving at 1' +/- .08".
I checked my time and it is correct and set for UTC. I did not turn off the 4x Step Res option, but plan to try that tomorrow (Monday) night when it is clear again. Is this possibly the cause? Or, am I missing something more obvious. I used to be able to solve down to a few seconds, with the target perfectly centered.
?
Thanks!
?
Art
?
This is not a Gemini 2 issues so much as one of your apps is pushing setting data or pulling setting data from elsewhere in the system.? Several other N.I.N.A. users here have reported various issues after updating their Gemini 2 L6 system which was resolved after fixing their settings.? So it is most likely that you have a configuration issue with one or more of your PC apps.?
?
--
Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
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On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 06:26 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
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Hi Art,
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I haven't really used N.I.N.A. in a few years as I am using the ZWO ASIAIR ecosystem with the Gemini 2 no problems here.? So I don't know what those users had to change to get it to stop doing this.?
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But if you do a search here it should be findable.?
?
--
Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
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On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 06:26 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
On Sunday, May 11, 2025, 11:41 PM, Chip Louie via groups.io <chiplouie@...> wrote:
On Sun, May 11, 2025 at 10:38 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Hello all, I just recently upgraded to the latest Gemini.net driver, as well as turned on RA/DEC 4x Step Res. I am at L6.12 on the G2
On my very next session, I was not able to accurately plate solve. The target would stay to the right, just at the edge of the FOV. NINA (PS3) would stop solving at 1' .08" or 0.52" which I thought odd that it was basically solving at 1' +/- .08".
I checked my time and it is correct and set for UTC. I did not turn off the 4x Step Res option, but plan to try that tomorrow (Monday) night when it is clear again. Is this possibly the cause? Or, am I missing something more obvious. I used to be able to solve down to a few seconds, with the target perfectly centered.
?
Thanks!
?
Art
?
This is not a Gemini 2 issues so much as one of your apps is pushing setting data or pulling setting data from elsewhere in the system.? Several other N.I.N.A. users here have reported various issues after updating their Gemini 2 L6 system which was resolved after fixing their settings.? So it is most likely that you have a configuration issue with one or more of your PC apps.?
?
--
Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
?
Hi Art,
?
Something feels wrong here.? When I updated to L6.12 from 6.11 nothing changed as far as functioning with ASIAIR goes, it just worked.??
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So let's go back the the beginning.? You said that you have L6.12 and that 4x resolution is enabled.? How did you update to L6.x and how did you enable the 4x setting?? ?I think you need to confirm the basic version information of your Gemini 2 firmware.? MU main unit, HC hand controller and PIC?
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Please go to the diamond screen and press Menu>HC>Info and post a screenshot or tell us what it says.? This will confirm that we are working on the firmware we think we are on.??
?
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Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
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Art, did you try to flip the Gemini Expects J2000 coordinates setting yet? Did that not help?
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On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 09:26 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
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Chip,
?The problem was resolved last night by unchecking the ¡°expects J2000¡± box. It platesolved perfectly (0 error). Then I rechecked the box and it platesolved fine, again. All of my fw is the latest.
On Tuesday, May 13, 2025, 7:15 PM, Paul Kanevsky <yh@...> wrote: Art, did you try to flip the Gemini Expects J2000 coordinates setting yet? Did that not help?
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On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 09:26 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
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Hi Paul,
?Unchecking J2000 allowed me to plate-solve with zero error. Then I checked the box, and plate-solved again with zero error. So that problem seems ti be resolved, albeit, weird. I have another problem but?I will open a new subject for it, and attach log files. Thank you for your help!
On Tuesday, May 13, 2025, 7:29 PM, Art Trail via groups.io <attrail1@...> wrote:
Chip,
?The problem was resolved last night by unchecking the ¡°expects J2000¡± box. It platesolved perfectly (0 error). Then I rechecked the box and it platesolved fine, again. All of my fw is the latest. On Tuesday, May 13, 2025, 7:15 PM, Paul Kanevsky <yh@...> wrote: Art, did you try to flip the Gemini Expects J2000 coordinates setting yet? Did that not help?
?
On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 09:26 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
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On Tue, May 13, 2025 at 05:33 PM, Art Trail wrote:
Hi Paul,
?
?Unchecking J2000 allowed me to plate-solve with zero error. Then I checked the box, and plate-solved again with zero error. So that problem seems ti be resolved, albeit, weird.
I have another problem but?I will open a new subject for it, and attach log files. Thank you for your help!
?
Art
On Tuesday, May 13, 2025, 7:29 PM, Art Trail via groups.io <attrail1@...> wrote:
Chip,
?
?The problem was resolved last night by unchecking the ¡°expects J2000¡± box. It platesolved perfectly (0 error). Then I rechecked the box and it platesolved fine, again. All of my fw is the latest.
On Tuesday, May 13, 2025, 7:15 PM, Paul Kanevsky <yh@...> wrote:
Art, did you try to flip the Gemini Expects J2000 coordinates setting yet? Did that not help?
?
On Mon, May 12, 2025 at 09:26 AM, Art Trail wrote:
Thank you Chip. Do you recall which setting?
?
I'm wondering how it can GOTO the same place with the J2000 on or off??
?
--
Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
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On Tue, May 13, 2025 at 11:43 PM, Chip Louie wrote:
I'm wondering how it can GOTO the same place with the J2000 on or off??
?
That is actually how it's supposed to work with NINA. The ASCOM driver tells NINA what precession coordinates are expected by Gemini, and NINA tries to ensure that the correct coordinates are sent. This may not work if some of the other apps settings are changed after they are connected to NINA, or if the apps are not reporting their precession settings correctly for some reason. It's a complex problem with many moving parts, all coordinated (pun not intended!) by NINA.?
?
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Oh right, duh!? I used to know that when I used PC apps under ASCOM.? With ASIAIR's planned community ecosystem I have basically forgotten all of the issues that need to be looked at every time you change or add something to the system.??
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I think this is a major positive to having a single brand system in this regard.? All the internal arguments are settled within that single app.? Even so it still seems that people have had and continue to have issues with the ASIAIR controller with certain brands of mounts, even the ZWO strain wave gearbox mounts.? It's a wonder that a 33+ year old mount with a 25 year old GOTO controller works at all let alone nearly perfectly with the ASIAIR and ASIAIR app.??
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Honestly I'm not missing chasing down this kind of minutiae to get my imaging gear to work.? Granted putting up with that is part of the hobby, for some part of the fun of getting to pick and choose your hardware but I really can't complain about the ZWO hardware other than the color and the fact that everyone else is using the same gear.??
?
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Chip Louie Chief Daydreamer Imagination Hardware?
Astrospheric - South Pasadena, CA?
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This is correct.
NINA internally works on the basis of J2000. Basically, anything that comes from a static database of coordinates - plate solve results, planetarium apps, NINA's own internal object database, the coordinates saved in targets and sequences - are all J2000. When telling the mount to slew to those coordinates, they are precessed, or transformed, accordingly based on what the mount driver advertises as its EquatorialSystem (that's the name of the ASCOM driver property). The precession is done via the widely-used routines that are part of the USNO's NOVAS library ().
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On May 14, 2025, at 08:05, Paul Kanevsky <yh@...> wrote:
On Tue, May 13, 2025 at 11:43 PM, Chip Louie wrote:
I'm wondering how it can GOTO the same place with the J2000 on or off?
That is actually how it's supposed to work with NINA. The ASCOM driver tells NINA what precession coordinates are expected by Gemini, and NINA tries to ensure that the correct coordinates are sent. This may not work if some of the other apps settings are changed after they are connected to NINA, or if the apps are not reporting their precession settings correctly for some reason. It's a complex problem with many moving parts, all coordinated (pun not intended!) by NINA.
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Art Trail
Paul Kanevsky
Chip Louie