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It used to be that there was not extreme polarizaton between the two parties.? There was an underlying concensus of where we wanted to be, and how to move forward.? That center does not exist anymore, and as a result there is no stability in our political system. Maybe it is a result of the internet.? Maybe we are just entering a different era.? But until we can arrive at a center point of gravity, so to speak, things we continue as they are now, and we will become a weak, vulnerable nation.
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On Mon, Jul 25, 2022 at 11:59 AM, Steve Sundur wrote:
That center does not exist anymore, and as a result there is no stability in our political system.
Yes, this, and the lack of a foundation based on a general consensus of fact.? See Fact #3 below.? ? It's hard to argue about the fact of natural disasters on the rise, however, so perhaps we can agree on just that.? Yes, extreme weather is here.? Period.?? Other facts? 1) Republicans have voted against protecting the right to abortion, the right to use birth control, the right to cross state lines to obtain reproductive health care, and gay marriage.
2) Oil giants ExxonMobil and Chevron reported historic profits from the last three months. Exxon made $17.9 billion (not a typo) last quarter, up 273% from the same time last year, while Chevron made $11.6 billion. Exxon’s rate of income was $2,245.62 every second of every day for the past 92 days; Chevron made $1,462.11 per second. Together, BP, Chevron, ExxonMobil, Shell, and TotalEnergies are expected to announce $60 billion in profits for the past three months. They plan to spend much of the profit not on reinvesting in their businesses, but on stock buybacks, which drives up the price of the stock.?
These record profits came at the same time that American consumers were staggering under high gas prices, which made up almost half of the increase in inflation of the past few months.???
3) The Department of Justice has indicted Aleksandr Viktorovich Ionov of Moscow, who, along with at least three other Russian officials, it says “engaged in a years-long foreign malign influence campaign targeting the United States.” Allegedly, Ionov recruited political groups in the U.S. and, with the supervision of the Russian government, illegally used their members to “sow division and spread misinformation inside the United States.” The targeted groups were located in Florida, Georgia, and California, and Ionov allegedly worked closely with them, directing and controlling their leaders, who appear to have been aware of his connection to the Russian government, since at least December 2014.
FBI special agent in charge David Walker today told reporters that Ionov’s actions were “some of the most egregious and blatant violations that we’ve seen by the Russian government in order to destabilize and undermine trust in American democracy.... The Russian intelligence threat is continuing and unrelenting.”
? --
Em
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3) The Department of Justice has indicted Aleksandr Viktorovich Ionov of Moscow, who, along with at least three other Russian officials, it says “engaged in a years-long foreign malign influence campaign targeting the United States.” Allegedly, Ionov recruited political groups in the U.S. and, with the supervision of the Russian government, illegally used their members to “sow division and spread misinformation inside the United States.” The targeted groups were located in Florida, Georgia, and California, and Ionov allegedly worked closely with them, directing and controlling their leaders, who appear to have been aware of his connection to the Russian government, since at least December 2014.
So this foreign, malign influence has finally produced some results DOJ-wise, even though it’s only been going on since… 2014?? ?At this rate we can expect Trump, Giuliani et al ?to be indicted sometime around 2050. ?Maybe.
We are truly broken as a democracy. ?Law no longer prevails…maybe it never really did, but at least we expected it to… only who you know and how far you can go before you get caught. ?Sad.
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On Mon, Jul 25, 2022 at 11:59 AM, Steve Sundur wrote:
That center does not exist anymore, and as a result there is no stability in our political system.
Yes, this, and the lack of a foundation based on a general consensus of fact.? See Fact #3 below.? ? It's hard to argue about the fact of natural disasters on the rise, however, so perhaps we can agree on just that.? Yes, extreme weather is here.? Period.?? Other facts? 1) Republicans have voted against protecting the right to abortion, the right to use birth control, the right to cross state lines to obtain reproductive health care, and gay marriage.
2) Oil giants ExxonMobil and Chevron reported historic profits from the last three months. Exxon made $17.9 billion (not a typo) last quarter, up 273% from the same time last year, while Chevron made $11.6 billion. Exxon’s rate of income was $2,245.62 every second of every day for the past 92 days; Chevron made $1,462.11 per second. Together, BP, Chevron, ExxonMobil, Shell, and TotalEnergies are expected to announce $60 billion in profits for the past three months. They plan to spend much of the profit not on reinvesting in their businesses, but on stock buybacks, which drives up the price of the stock.? These record profits came at the same time that American consumers were staggering under high gas prices, which made up almost half of the increase in inflation of the past few months.???
3) The Department of Justice has indicted Aleksandr Viktorovich Ionov of Moscow, who, along with at least three other Russian officials, it says “engaged in a years-long foreign malign influence campaign targeting the United States.” Allegedly, Ionov recruited political groups in the U.S. and, with the supervision of the Russian government, illegally used their members to “sow division and spread misinformation inside the United States.” The targeted groups were located in Florida, Georgia, and California, and Ionov allegedly worked closely with them, directing and controlling their leaders, who appear to have been aware of his connection to the Russian government, since at least December 2014.
FBI special agent in charge David Walker today told reporters that Ionov’s actions were “some of the most egregious and blatant violations that we’ve seen by the Russian government in order to destabilize and undermine trust in American democracy.... The Russian intelligence threat is continuing and unrelenting.”
? --
Em
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On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 10:07:35 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
Yes, this, and the lack of a foundation based on a general consensus of fact.? See Fact #3 below.? ?
It's hard to argue about the fact of natural disasters on the rise, however, so perhaps we can agree on just that.? Yes, extreme weather is here.? Period.??
Other facts?
1) Republicans have voted against protecting the right to abortion, the right to use birth control, the right to cross state lines to obtain reproductive health care, and gay marriage.
I was hoping someone might bring up abortion.? I have a couple thoughts about it.? They are just thoughts, and I'm not trying to convince anyone about it one way or the other.
But, I find it weird that Kamala Harris appears so outraged that ANYONE could object to abortion.? Abortion is gruesome.? A life, or potential life is being terminated. Is this not the case?? Is it surprising that a segment of the population would find this objectionable on religious, or other grounds? In the last fifty years there have been many numerous developments to prevent pregnancy.? That said, I do not support the ban on abortions.? The other observation I've made, is that abortion doctors, and abortion support staff, when they are interviewed, or when there are stories about them, seem rather seedy.? Abortion doctors in particular seem motivated by money.? Not hint of altruism that I've observed. Perhaps the best statement I've heard about abortion, is to "keep it safe and rare".
If Supreme Court goes after contraception and same sex marriage,?I think it will hit a brick wall.
2) Oil giants ExxonMobil and Chevron reported historic profits from the last three months. Exxon made $1 a7.9 billion (not a typo) last quarter, up 273% from the same time last year, while Chevron made $11.6 billion. Exxon’s rate of income was $2,245.62 every second of every day for the past 92 days; Chevron made $1,462.11 per second. Together, BP, Chevron, ExxonMobil, Shell, and TotalEnergies are expected to announce $60 billion in profits for the past three months. They plan to spend much of the profit not on reinvesting in their businesses, but on stock buybacks, which drives up the price of the stock.?
These record profits came at the same time that American consumers were staggering under high gas prices, which made up almost half of the increase in inflation of the past few months.??? Okay, another topic on my mind.? You realize of course, that for the past 5-10 years, oil profits have been depressed, at least historically speaking. The price of oil has much to do with the war in Ukraine.? Do you not realize the long-term?implication on energy this war is having? There is a huge incentive to move towards clean energy.? And if, somehow this war ends up with a diminished Russia, do you not realize the peace dividend this is going to create!? Russia has NOTHING going for it.? They are a failed state with NOTHING to lose, except that they are a global menace. They have fossil fuels and nuclear weapons, both of which they use to blackmail the rest of the world. There has been NO investment in their economy other than energy and weapons.? This war, assuming there is no nuclear component to it, is already shifting the balance of power.? China will continue to be an increasing military threat, of course.? BUT, they have a lot to lose.? They are an economic superpower, and a war of any sort would be disastrous?for them. And, the rest of the world, of course.
3) The Department of Justice has indicted Aleksandr Viktorovich Ionov of Moscow, who, along with at least three other Russian officials, it says “engaged in a years-long foreign malign influence campaign targeting the United States.” Allegedly, Ionov recruited political groups in the U.S. and, with the supervision of the Russian government, illegally used their members to “sow division and spread misinformation inside the United States.” The targeted groups were located in Florida, Georgia, and California, and Ionov allegedly worked closely with them, directing and controlling their leaders, who appear to have been aware of his connection to the Russian government, since at least December 2014.
FBI special agent in charge David Walker today told reporters that Ionov’s actions were “some of the most egregious and blatant violations that we’ve seen by the Russian government in order to destabilize and undermine trust in American democracy.... The Russian intelligence threat is continuing and unrelenting.”
And this why if Russia can be defeated in Ukraine, the global community will be FAR BETTER OFF.
?--
Em
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On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 11:24 AM, Steve Sundur wrote:
Yes, this, and the lack of a foundation based on a general consensus of fact.? See Fact #3 below.? ?
It's hard to argue about the fact of natural disasters on the rise, however, so perhaps we can agree on just that.? Yes, extreme weather is here.? Period.??
Other facts?
1) Republicans have voted against protecting the right to abortion, the right to use birth control, the right to cross state lines to obtain reproductive health care, and gay marriage.
?
I was hoping someone might bring up abortion.? I have a couple thoughts about it.? They are just thoughts, and I'm not trying to convince anyone about it one way or the other.
?
But, I find it weird that Kamala Harris appears so outraged that ANYONE could object to abortion.? Abortion is gruesome.? A life, or potential life is being terminated.
The body aborts all the time.? It's called miscarriage.? You have the right to think it's gruesome and the right to object, but you don't have the right to force me to carry an unwanted pregnancy (I'm speaking metaphorically).? The crux of the argument is about choice...that's what get's lost in trying to converse with the morality police today.? Women should have agency over their own bodies and their own choices.? It's about women's rights.? Period.? (As an aside, the way I see it, a "potential life" is a completely meaningless term.)? ? ??
Is this not the case?? Is it surprising that a segment of the population would find this objectionable on religious, or other grounds? In the last fifty years there have been many numerous developments to prevent pregnancy.? That said, I do not support the ban on abortions.? The other observation I've made, is that abortion doctors, and abortion support staff, when they are interviewed, or when there are stories about them, seem rather seedy.? Abortion doctors in particular seem motivated by money.? Not hint of altruism that I've observed. Perhaps the best statement I've heard about abortion, is to "keep it safe and rare".
?
If Supreme Court goes after contraception and same sex marriage,?I think it will hit a brick wall.??
2) Oil giants ExxonMobil and Chevron reported historic profits from the last three months. Exxon made $1 a7.9 billion (not a typo) last quarter, up 273% from the same time last year, while Chevron made $11.6 billion. Exxon’s rate of income was $2,245.62 every second of every day for the past 92 days; Chevron made $1,462.11 per second. Together, BP, Chevron, ExxonMobil, Shell, and TotalEnergies are expected to announce $60 billion in profits for the past three months. They plan to spend much of the profit not on reinvesting in their businesses, but on stock buybacks, which drives up the price of the stock.?
These record profits came at the same time that American consumers were staggering under high gas prices, which made up almost half of the increase in inflation of the past few months.???
Okay, another topic on my mind.? You realize of course, that for the past 5-10 years, oil profits have been depressed, at least historically speaking. The price of oil has much to do with the war in Ukraine.? Do you not realize the long-term?implication on energy this war is having? There is a huge incentive to move towards clean energy.? And if, somehow this war ends up with a diminished Russia, do you not realize the peace dividend this is going to create!? Russia has NOTHING going for it.? They are a failed state with NOTHING to lose, except that they are a global menace. They have fossil fuels and nuclear weapons, both of which they use to blackmail the rest of the world. There has been NO investment in their economy other than energy and weapons.? This war, assuming there is no nuclear component to it, is already shifting the balance of power.?
China will continue to be an increasing military threat, of course.? BUT, they have a lot to lose.? They are an economic superpower, and a war of any sort would be disastrous?for them. And, the rest of the world, of course.
3) The Department of Justice has indicted Aleksandr Viktorovich Ionov of Moscow, who, along with at least three other Russian officials, it says “engaged in a years-long foreign malign influence campaign targeting the United States.” Allegedly, Ionov recruited political groups in the U.S. and, with the supervision of the Russian government, illegally used their members to “sow division and spread misinformation inside the United States.” The targeted groups were located in Florida, Georgia, and California, and Ionov allegedly worked closely with them, directing and controlling their leaders, who appear to have been aware of his connection to the Russian government, since at least December 2014.
?
FBI special agent in charge David Walker today told reporters that Ionov’s actions were “some of the most egregious and blatant violations that we’ve seen by the Russian government in order to destabilize and undermine trust in American democracy.... The Russian intelligence threat is continuing and unrelenting.”
?
And this why if Russia can be defeated in Ukraine, the global community will be FAR BETTER OFF.??
?
?
? --
Em
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On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 09:22 AM, Sal Sunshine wrote:
We are truly broken as a democracy. ?Law no longer prevails…maybe it never really did, but at least we expected it to
Our country was set up as a flawed democracy.? And the rich and powerful and political get away with all kinds of stuff and always have.? If we elect an authoritarian cult leader, we can kiss it goodbye.? And the would-be authoritarians are chomping at the bit...there's more than just the Grand Wizard of Whine out there.? Better a flawed democracy than no democracy.?? ? --
Em
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? On Jul 30, 2022, at 7:17 PM, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
?On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 09:22 AM, Sal Sunshine wrote:
We are truly broken as a democracy. ?Law no longer prevails…maybe it never really did, but at least we expected it to
Our country was set up as a flawed democracy.? And the rich and powerful and political get away with all kinds of stuff and always have.? If we elect an authoritarian cult leader, we can kiss it goodbye.? And the would-be authoritarians are chomping at the bit...there's more than just the Grand Wizard of Whine out there.? Better a flawed democracy than no democracy.??
But has it ever really been even that? ?Supposedly we’ve only not been at war for around 10 years, 4 of those during the Carter administration. ? And now we have millions of weapons of war out in the streets, with an unhinged minority willing to use ?them at the ?slightest provocation.
I knew when they let the Bundys off with basically a slap on the wrist it was a huge mistake, ?it would just embolden them.
Democracy at the point of a gun. Freedom.
“?War is Peace Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is Strength”
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On Saturday, July 30, 2022 at 07:17:21 PM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
Our country was set up as a flawed democracy.? And the rich and powerful and political get away with all kinds of stuff and always have.? If we elect an authoritarian cult leader, we can kiss it goodbye.? And the would-be authoritarians are chomping at the bit...there's more than just the Grand Wizard of Whine out there.? Better a flawed democracy than no democracy.??
I'm sorry.? I know you think people use the "S" word in an attempt to put a label on others, but I can't help but think that the ideas you espouse basically do away with personal initiative.? Yes, the distribution of wealth is out of whack.? Seriously so. And the new climate change bill has provisions that will address that to some extent.? That, along with the global minimum tax for corporations that Janet Yellin is working on.?
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
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On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above??? ? --
Em
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On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 07:35 PM, Sal Sunshine wrote:
I knew when they let the Bundys off with basically a slap on the wrist it was a huge mistake, ?it would just embolden them.
?
You know, I thought exactly the same.?? ? --
Em
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Well, great minds and all that.
It was a huge mistake. ?Thise mofos pointed guns at federal agents.
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On Jul 31, 2022, at 9:00 AM, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
?On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 07:35 PM, Sal Sunshine wrote:
I knew when they let the Bundys off with basically a slap on the wrist it was a huge mistake, ?it would just embolden them.
?
You know, I thought exactly the same.?? ? --
Em
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Was wondering that myself! ?What S word? ?And how did we get from more equal pay to innovators being the bad guys? ?I don’t understand the train of thought here.
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On Jul 31, 2022, at 8:58 AM, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
?On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above??? ? --
Em
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On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
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On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 11:35:40 AM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
Okay. Thanks for your reply.? Nuff said.? I can see that personal accountability\responsibility has no bearing in your world view. I work with, and have mentored many black women, and have worked closely with many black men.? This may provide me a different perspective from someone in your situation who, I am guessing, has almost no contact with anyone in the black community.? The conclusions you draw are second hand, at best.
But that does not stop you from presenting your opinions as the ultimate authority.
?
On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 11:35:40 AM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
I dare you to answer this question.??
Why do you think so many black women under the age of 21, including many in their teens, are having babies?
You cannot dispute that this is the case, so why do you think this would be?
On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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I guess we can conclude, Sal, that you are unwilling, or unable to answer the question posed below. I assume, because it would undermine your assertion that the example?I brought up indicates vile and disgusting sexism, racism, and who knows what else.
When asked to provide one scintilla of evidence along these lines, you have nothing to say.
Of course, when I made my initial comment, you wasted no time in your response.? Like maybe a minute.? And yet, when asked to back up your claim, nothing but silence.??
I'm afraid this is indicative of many of the assertions made here. The truth, or facts, are of secondary importance.? Just a need to vent, I guess.
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 12:08:28 PM CDT, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 11:35:40 AM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
I dare you to answer this question.??
Why do you think so many black women under the age of 21, including many in their teens, are having babies?
You cannot dispute that this is the case, so why do you think this would be?
On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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Ok this once I’ll play your stupid game.
You made an assertion, provided no evidence of any sort… because you can’t … and then demanded that I “answer” it, thereby validating, to some degree, your racist ?and sexist ”fact.”
Prove it first if you want an answer. You can’t. Until then I will not engage with racism, sexism or any other kind of bigotry.
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On Jul 31, 2022, at 6:21 PM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
I guess we can conclude, Sal, that you are unwilling, or unable to answer the question posed below. I assume, because it would undermine your assertion that the example?I brought up indicates vile and disgusting sexism, racism, and who knows what else.
When asked to provide one scintilla of evidence along these lines, you have nothing to say.
Of course, when I made my initial comment, you wasted no time in your response.? Like maybe a minute.? And yet, when asked to back up your claim, nothing but silence.??
I'm afraid this is indicative of many of the assertions made here. The truth, or facts, are of secondary importance.? Just a need to vent, I guess.
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 12:08:28 PM CDT, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 11:35:40 AM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
I dare you to answer this question.??
Why do you think so many black women under the age of 21, including many in their teens, are having babies?
You cannot dispute that this is the case, so why do you think this would be?
On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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I asked a simple question.? You obviously are afraid to answer it.
I asked, simply, "Why do you think so many black girls have babies while they are still teenagers, or in their very early twenties"
Since you have indicated this is disgusting racist, and sexist matter I have brought up, I have asked for some clarification. But for you to do so would undermine all your assertions about this being a sexist and racist issue. That is why you will not answer the simple question.
And now you are engaging in comical obfuscation ala Sean Hannity, Tucker Carlson, Laura Ingraham and others, trying to make it appear that I am one not willing to back up my assertion.
I'm not buying, and I hope others here are not as well.
As me a question about something. I will not be afraid to answer it.
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 06:55:33 PM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Ok this once I’ll play your stupid game.
You made an assertion, provided no evidence of any sort… because you can’t … and then demanded that I “answer” it, thereby validating, to some degree, your racist ?and sexist ”fact.”
Prove it first if you want an answer. You can’t. Until then I will not engage with racism, sexism or any other kind of bigotry.
On Jul 31, 2022, at 6:21 PM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
I guess we can conclude, Sal, that you are unwilling, or unable to answer the question posed below. I assume, because it would undermine your assertion that the example?I brought up indicates vile and disgusting sexism, racism, and who knows what else.
When asked to provide one scintilla of evidence along these lines, you have nothing to say.
Of course, when I made my initial comment, you wasted no time in your response.? Like maybe a minute.? And yet, when asked to back up your claim, nothing but silence.??
I'm afraid this is indicative of many of the assertions made here. The truth, or facts, are of secondary importance.? Just a need to vent, I guess.
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 12:08:28 PM CDT, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 11:35:40 AM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
I dare you to answer this question.??
Why do you think so many black women under the age of 21, including many in their teens, are having babies?
You cannot dispute that this is the case, so why do you think this would be?
On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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Oh look son, a racist!
Prove your “fact” first, and then I will answer. ?As I do not agree with the premise, I need facts first. You cannot provide them.
What you are engaging in now is called gaslighting, it’s an old, tried and true game of those who have no integrity, to try and turn the tables on the other person when the other person tells them something about themselves that they don’t like.
Too bad.
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On Jul 31, 2022, at 7:31 PM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
I asked a simple question.? You obviously are afraid to answer it.
I asked, simply, "Why do you think so many black girls have babies while they are still teenagers, or in their very early twenties"
Since you have indicated this is disgusting racist, and sexist matter I have brought up, I have asked for some clarification. But for you to do so would undermine all your assertions about this being a sexist and racist issue. That is why you will not answer the simple question.
And now you are engaging in comical obfuscation ala Sean Hannity, Tucker Carlson, Laura Ingraham and others, trying to make it appear that I am one not willing to back up my assertion.
I'm not buying, and I hope others here are not as well.
As me a question about something. I will not be afraid to answer it.
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 06:55:33 PM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Ok this once I’ll play your stupid game.
You made an assertion, provided no evidence of any sort… because you can’t … and then demanded that I “answer” it, thereby validating, to some degree, your racist ?and sexist ”fact.”
Prove it first if you want an answer. You can’t. Until then I will not engage with racism, sexism or any other kind of bigotry. On Jul 31, 2022, at 6:21 PM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
I guess we can conclude, Sal, that you are unwilling, or unable to answer the question posed below. I assume, because it would undermine your assertion that the example?I brought up indicates vile and disgusting sexism, racism, and who knows what else.
When asked to provide one scintilla of evidence along these lines, you have nothing to say.
Of course, when I made my initial comment, you wasted no time in your response.? Like maybe a minute.? And yet, when asked to back up your claim, nothing but silence.??
I'm afraid this is indicative of many of the assertions made here. The truth, or facts, are of secondary importance.? Just a need to vent, I guess.
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 12:08:28 PM CDT, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 11:35:40 AM CDT, Sal Sunshine <salsunshineiniowa@...> wrote:
Be glad to answer… it’s racist, straight up. ?Also sexist. ?Singling out black women, when the problem runs across most of humanity, while also giving the men who got ?them into these situations a free pass is disgraceful. ?
I dare you to answer this question.??
Why do you think so many black women under the age of 21, including many in their teens, are having babies?
You cannot dispute that this is the case, so why do you think this would be?
On Jul 31, 2022, at 11:30 AM, Steve Sundur via groups.io <steve.sundur@...> wrote:
?
On Sunday, July 31, 2022 at 08:58:53 AM CDT, Emily Mae via groups.io <emily.mae50@...> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 30, 2022 at 08:08 PM, Steve Sundur wrote:
But you seem to imply that any who works hard, who comes up with innovations, and is rewarded thus, is somehow undeserving, and has gamed the system.?
Hey, I don't know what you mean here.? What is the "S" word?? "Structural"?? Are you saying that because I'm acknowledging the existence of "Structural racism", I'm saying what you state above????
I'm sorry.? That was very unclear.? The "S" work I'm referring to was "socialist".? But, since you bring up racism, I am wondering where you draw the line between personal responsibility/accountability and racism, as it pertains to some of the endemic problems in the black community.
For example, do black women giving birth in their teens, with no male figure in the picture, or perhaps a revolving door of black men, is this racism, or a matter of personal choice.??
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Emily Mae
Sal Sunshine