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Mic recommendation for TR-3

 

I understand that the Shure 444d is a good match to the Drakes.

They're becoming harder to find, prices are rising, and many have

been 'rode hard and put up wet'.

What other mics are worth a look, please?

I'd prefer a hand mic but a desk mic may be OK.

Also, has anyone rigged a wireless headset-mic with good results?

I tend to listen more than talking and don't sit still very well ...

Thanks,

David/doc KD4E
 

FWIW, the 444 has a sharply rising response curve, peaking at about 3000 Hz. It is very similar to the D-104. This was thought to produce good articulation in the presence of noise. It may do that but I find it metallic and unnatural sounding.
My microphone are all antiques. My favorite for ham radio is an Electro-Voice 664. This is a cardioid using EV's patented "Variable-D" principal which has very little proximity effect. That is the boost in apparent lows when used close. It has a fairly flat response with a mild and broad high frequency bump.
The data sheets for all three, the 444, D-104, 664 are on line at various sites. While the curves will not tell you exactly what a microphone sounds like they can give you a hint. There are newer versions of all of them which may be easier to find or cheaper. Note that none of these companies support their very old products or even have much idea of their own history.

On 12/1/2023 12:58 PM, DavidC KD4E wrote:
I understand that the Shure 444d is a good match to the Drakes.
They're becoming harder to find, prices are rising, and many have
been 'rode hard and put up wet'.
What other mics are worth a look, please?
I'd prefer a hand mic but a desk mic may be OK.
Also, has anyone rigged a wireless headset-mic with good results?
I tend to listen more than talking and don't sit still very well ...
Thanks,
David/doc KD4E
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

FWIW, I purchased a Heil Pro7 headset and used it (along with an Audix matching transformer) with my TR7. I received positive audio reports. Specifically, I was told I had "very good communications quality" audio, which I took as high praise. I also purchased a Heil PR781 but, alas, the rig had to go back into the shop before I could set it up. I'll be happy to share the results when I'm back on the air...

?

Best 73,

joe

?

joseph n. graif

k4jng

?

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of DavidC KD4E
Sent: Friday, December 1, 2023 3:58 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [DRAKE-RADIO] Mic recommendation for TR-3

?

I understand that the Shure 444d is a good match to the Drakes.

?

They're becoming harder to find, prices are rising, and many have

?

been 'rode hard and put up wet'.

?

What other mics are worth a look, please?

?

I'd prefer a hand mic but a desk mic may be OK.

?

Also, has anyone rigged a wireless headset-mic with good results?

?

I tend to listen more than talking and don't sit still very well ...

?

Thanks,

?

David/doc KD4E

?

?

?

?

?
 

You don't _need_ a 444D unless you want a dual impedance and/or black mic. The "D" means dual impedance, switchable between the high and low. The standard gray 444 high impedance dynamic will work just as well.

Sure also made a hand mic version of the 444 under a different model number. Also any of the vintage Turner high impedance ceramic desk or hand mics would work well.

And of course any of the mics that Richard cited are also good.

73

-Jim
NU0C


On Fri, 1 Dec 2023 15:58:27 -0500
"DavidC KD4E" <qrv@...> wrote:

I understand that the Shure 444d is a good match to the Drakes.

They're becoming harder to find, prices are rising, and many have

been 'rode hard and put up wet'.

What other mics are worth a look, please?

I'd prefer a hand mic but a desk mic may be OK.

Also, has anyone rigged a wireless headset-mic with good results?

I tend to listen more than talking and don't sit still very well ...

Thanks,

David/doc KD4E
 

Thanks!

On 12/1/23 19:56, Jim Shorney wrote:
You don't _need_ a 444D unless you want a dual impedance and/or black mic. The "D" means dual impedance, switchable between the high and low. The standard gray 444 high impedance dynamic will work just as well.

Sure also made a hand mic version of the 444 under a different model number. Also any of the vintage Turner high impedance ceramic desk or hand mics would work well.

And of course any of the mics that Richard cited are also good.

73

-Jim
NU0C


On Fri, 1 Dec 2023 15:58:27 -0500
"DavidC KD4E" <qrv@...> wrote:

I understand that the Shure 444d is a good match to the Drakes.

They're becoming harder to find, prices are rising, and many have

been 'rode hard and put up wet'.

What other mics are worth a look, please?

I'd prefer a hand mic but a desk mic may be OK.

Also, has anyone rigged a wireless headset-mic with good results?

I tend to listen more than talking and don't sit still very well ...

Thanks,

David/doc KD4E
 

I've not used any Shure mics with my Drake rigs.? I have a couple of
Electro Voice 638 mics I use with the TR-4 and TR-7.

73

Stan
KM4HQE

On 12/1/23 14:58, DavidC KD4E wrote:
I understand that the Shure 444d is a good match to the Drakes.

They're becoming harder to find, prices are rising, and many have

been 'rode hard and put up wet'.

What other mics are worth a look, please?

I'd prefer a hand mic but a desk mic may be OK.

Also, has anyone rigged a wireless headset-mic with good results?

I tend to listen more than talking and don't sit still very well ...

Thanks,

David/doc KD4E
 

Turner 254HC is what I use. ?Purchased NIB from a retired Turner dealer. ?Made of metal so it should age much better than the faded plastic Shure 444s. ?Also use a D104 and Electrovoice 729. The Turner and ElectroVoice are my favorite.?
 

One of my better mics is a D-104 with a Heil element in it.?

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.


Sent from for iOS


On Fri, Dec 1, 2023 at 20:22, JohnL <John.lengeling@...> wrote:
Turner 254HC is what I use. ?Purchased NIB from a retired Turner dealer. ?Made of metal so it should age much better than the faded plastic Shure 444s. ?Also use a D104 and Electrovoice 729. The Turner and ElectroVoice are my favorite.?

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Does it matter what form factor the Heil element rests in?

Would it be about as good in a handheld or a headset-mic?

Thanks,

David/doc KD4E

On 12/2/23 07:39, Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 via groups.io wrote:

One of my better mics is a D-104 with a Heil element in it.?

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4
 

Put elements in hard foam.?

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.


Sent from for iOS


On Sat, Dec 2, 2023 at 12:49, DavidC KD4E <qrv@...> wrote:

Does it matter what form factor the Heil element rests in?

Would it be about as good in a handheld or a headset-mic?

Thanks,

David/doc KD4E

On 12/2/23 07:39, Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 via groups.io wrote:
One of my better mics is a D-104 with a Heil element in it.

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4
 

Not sure what you are asking. If you mean does the outside shape of the microphone affect its response the answer is definitely yes. Diffraction around the case and the shape of the case affect the response. There are details in text books on acoustics many of which can be found free on the web.
The D-104 response is partly due to its shape and size, partly due to the size of the diaphragm and partly due to resonances delibrately introduced in the diaphragm and coupling to the crystal element.
When it was first intruduced, in 1933, a flat response version of the D-104 was offered in addition to the "voice response" version that we are familiar with. Evidently it was the voice version that sold and was continued. Whether by design or chance this response was successful and many other microphones were made to have a similar response.
The D-104 was the first crystal microphone on the market, followed by a great many others. The original idea was attributed and patented by C.B.Sawyer and licensed by Brush Development Company, who also made several crystal microphones. Crystal elements have some virtues: they are relatively cheap, have very high output, can have good fidelity. In the days when electronic amplification was expensive the output level was important. A crystal microphone or phonograph pickup could save a stage of vacuum tube amplification. They also have vices, they are sensitive to moisture, temperature and mechanical or electrical shock. The moisture problem was addressed in several ways and accounts for the trade-named methods like "Metal Seal" found on crystal devices of all sorts. Sealing could be effective but crystal devices still did not to well in humid environments. Also, the temperature limit is somewhere around 90F, don't remember exactly, in any case a hot day might be enough to ruin a crystal mic. Mechanical shock can cause the crystal to shatter. Could happen from dropping a microphone, pulling a phono pickup across the grooves of a record or dropping it, electrical shock happens when a crystal is used as a source such as a headphone or record cutter, overloading it can fracture it.
In any case, ceramic elements offered most of the advantages of crystals (except the high output) and were far more immune to moisture, temperature and shock so eventually supplanted them. Modern microphones use electret elements which don't have any of the crystal problems and have almost totally supplanted both crystal and carbon elements.
I don't know what Heil uses.

On 12/2/2023 9:49 AM, DavidC KD4E wrote:
Does it matter what form factor the Heil element rests in?
Would it be about as good in a handheld or a headset-mic?
Thanks,
David/doc KD4E
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
 

The original D-104 mounting is some sort of dense cotton wool. I don't know exactly what it is. I suspect it has somewhat better isolation from vibration (shock) than Styrofoam. Might not be important for a D-104.

On 12/2/2023 11:06 AM, Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 via groups.io wrote:
Put elements in hard foam.
Steve Wedge, W1ES/4
--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998
 

The stuff I got with my Heil element was the closed-cell, sort of hard,shiny foam.?

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.


Sent from for iOS


On Sat, Dec 2, 2023 at 15:49, Richard Knoppow <1oldlens1@...> wrote:
The original D-104 mounting is some sort of dense cotton wool. I
don't know exactly what it is. I suspect it has somewhat better
isolation from vibration (shock) than Styrofoam. Might not be important
for a D-104.

On 12/2/2023 11:06 AM, Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 via groups.io wrote:
> Put elements in hard foam.
>
> Steve Wedge, W1ES/4


--
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles
WB6KBL
SKCC 19998

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