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Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

Did you put the meter for reverse and adjust the capacitor for minimum first ?

There are 2 schematics that I know of for the wattmeters are you sure you are looking at the correct one ?? I don't recall the difference but think that it has to do with the veritable? resistors where you have to set one range and then the other range and the other schematic you can adjust either range separately.? The schematic you have is where you set the 200 watt range first and then set the 2000 watt range.

Did you try loosening and then tightening the nuts on the meter wiring ?


Ralph ku4pt


On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 08:25:28 PM EST, Mike Bryce <prosolar@...> wrote:


Hi, Ron,

already checked the meter movements and they all seem to be working fine.

I¡¯ve been poking around with one of the meters.

Trimmer R4 sets the calibration for the 200W scale.
Voltage from D1, (from the pickup generated by D1) goes through R4 to the meter switch and then through the 2.2K resistor to the meter. It¡¯s that simple! However, I can¡¯t set the meter to 100W with 100W from the transmitter (using a bird wattmeter and correct slug)?

When the 2000W position is selected, voltage ?goes through R4, then R3 and R2. R2 set the 2000W scale.

I put in a 5K trimmer for R4, and I can somewhat set the meter. Even with R4 out of the circuit, the meter can¡¯t quite make full 100W deflection.?

What¡¯s that mean? I don¡¯t know. I suspect the D1 isn¡¯t up to snuff, it tests fine. Resistor R5 is good, too.

So far, I can¡¯t find any of the 1N295 diodes, although I¡¯m sure the 1N34A diodes will work. I don¡¯t have any of those either, and the chinese imports are $2 a pop.

It¡¯s a real head scratcher!


Mike, WB8VGE
Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

µþ´Ç²ú¡­

Those parts are not diodes¡­some kind of SMD device for control circuits.?

The 1n34a is listed as obsolete?

Mike

Btw. Found some 1n270 at Jameco



Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.

?


On Jan 19, 2024, at 10:25 PM, K6OXN Bob <bobk6oxn@...> wrote:

?link for 1N34A??

73? Bob

Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

link for 1N34A??

73? Bob
Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

I can¡¯t find a listing for them on mouser. Will check again?

Mike?


Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.

?


On Jan 19, 2024, at 8:58 PM, K6OXN Bob <bobk6oxn@...> wrote:

?The last time I needed 1N34A or 1N295 diodes, Mouser had them for about 75 cents each.

Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

The last time I needed 1N34A or 1N295 diodes, Mouser had them for about 75 cents each.
Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Hi, Ron,

already checked the meter movements and they all seem to be working fine.

I¡¯ve been poking around with one of the meters.

Trimmer R4 sets the calibration for the 200W scale.
Voltage from D1, (from the pickup generated by D1) goes through R4 to the meter switch and then through the 2.2K resistor to the meter. It¡¯s that simple! However, I can¡¯t set the meter to 100W with 100W from the transmitter (using a bird wattmeter and correct slug)?

When the 2000W position is selected, voltage ?goes through R4, then R3 and R2. R2 set the 2000W scale.

I put in a 5K trimmer for R4, and I can somewhat set the meter. Even with R4 out of the circuit, the meter can¡¯t quite make full 100W deflection.?

What¡¯s that mean? I don¡¯t know. I suspect the D1 isn¡¯t up to snuff, it tests fine. Resistor R5 is good, too.

So far, I can¡¯t find any of the 1N295 diodes, although I¡¯m sure the 1N34A diodes will work. I don¡¯t have any of those either, and the chinese imports are $2 a pop.

It¡¯s a real head scratcher!


Mike, WB8VGE
Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

Mike first you need to be sure that the ones that doesn¡¯t work at all DO have good panel meters
Take the wires off the meters and put a VTVM or VOM that is on the ohms scale, across the meters and see if they deflect.
You may need to play with the ohm setting in the vtvm. Or reverse the leads?
If you can¡¯t get any deflection at all, or no continuity reading at all the panel meter itself may be bad

Hope this helps

Why do we hoard W4¡¯s? I have 7 myself LOL

Ron W5sum?

On Jan 19, 2024, at 5:35?PM, Ralph Mowery via groups.io <ku4pt@...> wrote:

?
1. Check meter connections. I had a bird meter that developed corrosion under the nuts.?

2? Check coax to dummy load and dummy load for 50 ohms.

ralph ku4pt




On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 06:01:35 PM EST, mike bryce <prosolar@...> wrote:



Gang,?

It¡¯s been too cold to do much outside, so I¡¯ve been tinkering around in the shack.

I have a nice collection of Drake W4 Wattmeter. I think there are six or so in the collection. So I decided to take them down off of the shelve one at a time and test them.

As it turns out, five out of the six are broken, and for the life of me, I can¡¯t figure out why.

First problem.

Some meters have no indication of RF.
YES!! I checked the diodes and they are fine. I have continuity between the meter¡¯s switch and the sensor box.
The adjustments have no affect. Cleaned the switch in the meter box.?

Switching the input/output and nothing on SWR power scales.

Second problem:

The ones that do show meter deflection, I can¡¯t calibrate them. They are off the scale on 100W RF. Meter pegs on 200W scale, 2000W scale, and in both reflected scales.
I¡¯ve checked the 47K resistors, the diodes, the 68¦¸ resistor and everything seems okay.

This is such a simple circuit, I¡¯m either overthinking it, or simply can¡¯t see the forest for the trees¡­

I¡¯m up for a few suggestions

Mike wb8vge
_._,_.__,_._,_
Re: Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

1. Check meter connections. I had a bird meter that developed corrosion under the nuts.?

2? Check coax to dummy load and dummy load for 50 ohms.

ralph ku4pt




On Friday, January 19, 2024 at 06:01:35 PM EST, mike bryce <prosolar@...> wrote:



Gang,?

It¡¯s been too cold to do much outside, so I¡¯ve been tinkering around in the shack.

I have a nice collection of Drake W4 Wattmeter. I think there are six or so in the collection. So I decided to take them down off of the shelve one at a time and test them.

As it turns out, five out of the six are broken, and for the life of me, I can¡¯t figure out why.

First problem.

Some meters have no indication of RF.
YES!! I checked the diodes and they are fine. I have continuity between the meter¡¯s switch and the sensor box.
The adjustments have no affect. Cleaned the switch in the meter box.?

Switching the input/output and nothing on SWR power scales.

Second problem:

The ones that do show meter deflection, I can¡¯t calibrate them. They are off the scale on 100W RF. Meter pegs on 200W scale, 2000W scale, and in both reflected scales.
I¡¯ve checked the 47K resistors, the diodes, the 68¦¸ resistor and everything seems okay.

This is such a simple circuit, I¡¯m either overthinking it, or simply can¡¯t see the forest for the trees¡­

I¡¯m up for a few suggestions

Mike wb8vge
_._,_.__,_._,_
Drake W4 wattmeter woes...

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý


Gang,?

It¡¯s been too cold to do much outside, so I¡¯ve been tinkering around in the shack.

I have a nice collection of Drake W4 Wattmeter. I think there are six or so in the collection. So I decided to take them down off of the shelve one at a time and test them.

As it turns out, five out of the six are broken, and for the life of me, I can¡¯t figure out why.

First problem.

Some meters have no indication of RF.
YES!! I checked the diodes and they are fine. I have continuity between the meter¡¯s switch and the sensor box.
The adjustments have no affect. Cleaned the switch in the meter box.?

Switching the input/output and nothing on SWR power scales.

Second problem:

The ones that do show meter deflection, I can¡¯t calibrate them. They are off the scale on 100W RF. Meter pegs on 200W scale, 2000W scale, and in both reflected scales.
I¡¯ve checked the 47K resistors, the diodes, the 68¦¸ resistor and everything seems okay.

This is such a simple circuit, I¡¯m either overthinking it, or simply can¡¯t see the forest for the trees¡­

I¡¯m up for a few suggestions

Mike wb8vge
Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

$7 is a great deal for real Apple!
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?

On 01/19/2024 10:40 AM PST Bill KJ5BNE via groups.io <whb5k@...> wrote:
?
?
?
I¡¯ve been buying new Apple accessories from Other World Computing for decades. ?They have genuine Apple 1¡± sq. 5W wall warts for $7 and new, larger, 12W Apple wall warts for $13. ?
?
?

73,
Bill
KJ5BNE
?
++++++++++++++++
Bill Blodgett
Arlington, Texas
?

On Jan 19, 2024, at 11:33?AM, wb6ogd <garywinblad@...> wrote:

Yes.? They used to give you one with each new phone or gadget.
Between us and the kids, we got a lot.? Yup, never fail.. and are clean for RFI.
Unfortunately they don't give them away anymore and I think they cost like $40.
If you have to buy one though you need to be careful of counterfeits,? they look identical
on the outside but they left out all the protection circuitry and stuff!
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?
On 01/19/2024 9:25 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
We have several of them floating around the house and, knock on wood, I've never seen one fail.
?
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>, "n4buq" <n4buq@...>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 11:22:58 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer
Barry,
True, but that was a long time ago.
And I am using the Apple wart to power other things.. (as well as charging my phone).
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?
On 01/19/2024 9:06 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
It used to be that iPhones wouldn't charge on just any 5V USB charger.? There is/was an extra wire that signaled the iPhone it could charge from the charger which essentially meant you had to buy Apple's more expensive charger.? I don't think that's still the case since Apple switched to the smaller charger connector.
?
Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 9:12:34 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

?
Re: 2NT Spot Switch?

 

Dan,
Thanks for this post! My 2C stopped working on most bands. I cleaned the Aux switch as you suggested and it miraculously came back to life. Your post certainly saved me a lot of troubleshooting time!
73,
--
Dave, KC2MB
Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

*** Is this a 6.3VAC or 12.6VAC filament circuit? If it's 6.3, you might
want to use a voltage doubler. Lemme see: 6.3V RMS = 8.9V peak. Yup,
definitely needs a doubler. - Jerry, KF6VB

12.6 VAC and 6.3 VAC is available in the TR-4Cw. I've decided to use a
LM2940-10.0 regulator. It's LDO drop-out spec is 0.5V.

Paul, W9AC
Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

On 2024-01-19 05:17, Paul Christensen wrote:
"Paul, what's the current requirement for that VFO stabilizer board?
73/jeff/ac0c"
Jeff,
No spec but the stabilizer has four CMOS chips and one LED with the
LED drawing the most current. So, 15-20 mA. Either a 78L10 or 1/2W
10V Zener should be fine. The 78Lxx devices are good to a max current
of 100mA. Rather than one 'lytic filter cap, I'll use four in
parallel after the half-wave rectifier.
*** Is this a 6.3VAC or 12.6VAC filament circuit? If it's 6.3, you might
want to use a voltage doubler. Lemme see: 6.3V RMS = 8.9V peak. Yup,
definitely needs a doubler.

- Jerry, KF6VB







Paul, W9AC
Links:
------
[1] /g/DRAKE-RADIO/message/75614
[2] /mt/103815427/243852
[3] /g/DRAKE-RADIO/post
[4] /g/DRAKE-RADIO/editsub/243852
[5] /g/DRAKE-RADIO/leave/12260778/243852/767576506/xyzzy
Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý


I¡¯ve been buying new Apple accessories from Other World Computing for decades. ?They have genuine Apple 1¡± sq. 5W wall warts for $7 and new, larger, 12W Apple wall warts for $13. ?



73,
Bill
KJ5BNE

++++++++++++++++
Bill Blodgett
Arlington, Texas


On Jan 19, 2024, at 11:33?AM, wb6ogd <garywinblad@...> wrote:

?
Yes.? They used to give you one with each new phone or gadget.
Between us and the kids, we got a lot.? Yup, never fail.. and are clean for RFI.
Unfortunately they don't give them away anymore and I think they cost like $40.
If you have to buy one though you need to be careful of counterfeits,? they look identical
on the outside but they left out all the protection circuitry and stuff!
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?
On 01/19/2024 9:25 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
We have several of them floating around the house and, knock on wood, I've never seen one fail.
?
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>, "n4buq" <n4buq@...>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 11:22:58 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer
Barry,
True, but that was a long time ago.
And I am using the Apple wart to power other things.. (as well as charging my phone).
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?
On 01/19/2024 9:06 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
It used to be that iPhones wouldn't charge on just any 5V USB charger.? There is/was an extra wire that signaled the iPhone it could charge from the charger which essentially meant you had to buy Apple's more expensive charger.? I don't think that's still the case since Apple switched to the smaller charger connector.
?
Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 9:12:34 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

?

Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

I've found that the tiny or featherweight ones tend to have little or no EMI filtering. If it feels beefy when you pick it up it probably has some decent filtering and fault protection. I bought some cheap USB chargers once because I needed something quick and dirty to use at work. That's exactly what I got but I knew what I was buying and I wanted something that wouldn't be a big loss if it decided to go walkabout. It is almost scary how little was inside the things. They do work but I don't think they are very safe.

73

-Jim
NU0C

On Fri, 19 Jan 2024 07:12:34 -0800
"wb6ogd" <garywinblad@...> wrote:

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

P3020139r.jpg
P3020159r.jpg
P3020135r.jpg

Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

Yes.? They used to give you one with each new phone or gadget.
Between us and the kids, we got a lot.? Yup, never fail.. and are clean for RFI.
Unfortunately they don't give them away anymore and I think they cost like $40.
If you have to buy one though you need to be careful of counterfeits,? they look identical
on the outside but they left out all the protection circuitry and stuff!
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?

On 01/19/2024 9:25 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
We have several of them floating around the house and, knock on wood, I've never seen one fail.
?
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>, "n4buq" <n4buq@...>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 11:22:58 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer
Barry,
True, but that was a long time ago.
And I am using the Apple wart to power other things.. (as well as charging my phone).
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?
On 01/19/2024 9:06 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
It used to be that iPhones wouldn't charge on just any 5V USB charger.? There is/was an extra wire that signaled the iPhone it could charge from the charger which essentially meant you had to buy Apple's more expensive charger.? I don't think that's still the case since Apple switched to the smaller charger connector.
?
Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 9:12:34 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

?

Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

We have several of them floating around the house and, knock on wood, I've never seen one fail.

Barry - N4BUQ

From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>, "n4buq" <n4buq@...>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 11:22:58 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer
Barry,
True, but that was a long time ago.
And I am using the Apple wart to power other things.. (as well as charging my phone).
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?
On 01/19/2024 9:06 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
It used to be that iPhones wouldn't charge on just any 5V USB charger.? There is/was an extra wire that signaled the iPhone it could charge from the charger which essentially meant you had to buy Apple's more expensive charger.? I don't think that's still the case since Apple switched to the smaller charger connector.
?
Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 9:12:34 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

?


Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

Barry,
True, but that was a long time ago.
And I am using the Apple wart to power other things.. (as well as charging my phone).
73,
Gary
WB6OGD
?

On 01/19/2024 9:06 AM PST n4buq <n4buq@...> wrote:
?
?
It used to be that iPhones wouldn't charge on just any 5V USB charger.? There is/was an extra wire that signaled the iPhone it could charge from the charger which essentially meant you had to buy Apple's more expensive charger.? I don't think that's still the case since Apple switched to the smaller charger connector.
?
Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ
?
From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 9:12:34 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

?

Re: K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

 

¿ªÔÆÌåÓý

For homebrew stuff, and things I've refurbed and worry a bit about, I have started putting in TVS diodes across the circuit input, post regulator.? This is sort of a quick & easy poor man's overvoltage protection method in that the TVS can disipate a ton of power and in the event of a failing pass transistor in a regulator can force a primary side fuse to pop.? TVS are cheap and it's easy to do other than picking the right value.

73/jeff/ac0c
alpha-charlie-zero-charlie
On 1/19/2024 11:06 AM, n4buq wrote:

It used to be that iPhones wouldn't charge on just any 5V USB charger.? There is/was an extra wire that signaled the iPhone it could charge from the charger which essentially meant you had to buy Apple's more expensive charger.? I don't think that's still the case since Apple switched to the smaller charger connector.

Thanks,
Barry - N4BUQ

From: "GARY WINBLAD" <garywinblad@...>
To: "DRAKE-RADIO" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2024 9:12:34 AM
Subject: Re: [DRAKE-RADIO] K4DPK VFO Stabilizer

Modern switching wall warts are pretty good.
Think about it, they power all kinds of expensive sensitive gadgets.. ie: the $1k iPhone in your pocket!
I especially like the little 1in Apple wart.? I have had one of those powering my Arduino/Si5351 GPSDO for years now and not a problem.
There are counterfeits out there though which have a fraction of the parts inside as the Apple.
73,
Gary
WB6OGD

?


Re: Hamfest TR-3

 

As much as I dislike "shotgunning" parts, if there are paper caps, they should all be replaced.? Be aware that Drake used a lot of Sprague caps and that the black tubular ones with red lettering are NOT paper and are usually good "forever".? The TR-3 was made at a time when manufacturers were transitioning away from paper capacitors towards ceramic, poly and other better materials.? These capacitors shouldn't be replaced as part of a restoration.

Remember that whenever anything is replaced, we all introduce the risk of replacing a good part with a bad one, installing a part wrong or damaging something else whilst you are "in there" (melting with a soldering iron comes to mind here).

I like to leave everything until I have had a chance to see if the rig is working, first.? You need a baseline from whence you go towards improvement.? This is also very true if you're going to do a major (i.e., kitchen sink) cleaning.? You want it working first.

73,

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4

Time flies like an arrow.? Fruit flies like a banana.

Sent with secure email.

On Friday, January 19th, 2024 at 10:12 AM, Steve Wedge, W1ES/4 via groups.io <w1es@...> wrote:

Dave, the small 10 uF is probably for the cathode of the audio output tube (6AQ5).?It¡¯s a good idea to replace it.?

If the rig is working well, don¡¯t worry about the resistors yet. Just about all of them are 10% parts.?

73,

Steve Wedge, W1ES/4

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.


Sent from for iOS


On Fri, Jan 19, 2024 at 10:04, Dave via groups.io <kc3am@...> wrote:
OK everyone,

I am finally starting to look into the TR-3 in depth as has been suggested

I have received the replacement caps from Hayseed Hamfest for my TR-3.
The original can is still in place.
I will replace the can this weekend instead of playing in the new fallen
snow.
I have yet to find where the small 10uf is. Can someone give me an idea
where this cap is?

What style tubular cap is on the stand up boards?
Should they be replaced?
I do not have a capacitor checker.

I have randomly measured some resistors in circuit and there are some
that are off value.
What is the preferred replacement style resistor?

Any other suggestions.

Thanks much,

Dave KC3AM







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