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Re: SEM Servo Motors

Jon Elson
 

John Ross wrote:

From: John Ross <johnr@...>

I pulled one of the servo motors from the Gantry router I picked up
yesterday. I says SEM Small Electrical Motor Company DC Servo
Motor. Type
30R4-42 Const Stall Torque 28 Lb in. Max PRM 3200 Volts 135 Pulse
Amps 52.
Where would I find a driver to power these things? The Camtronics
Looks
like its 36 volts and 10A. Who makes a 135 V 52 amp servo amp?
Before you go searching for such an amp, you might compute what
force this can provide to the machine, and see if it is necessary
to get full performance from the motor. I suspect you'll find
that 7 KW is not necessary for your machine (but maybe it is).

It is quite possible that running this motor up to full RPM or full
torque would break parts or at least cause excessive wear to
your machine. Is it belt driven (from the motor to leadscrew)?
If so, the belt might be the limiting factor. I had the acceleration
turned too high on my EMC setup when I first moved to it, and
was sort of worried about the 'bump' when it started moving.
A few weeks later, it broke a relatively new belt, and I realized the
acceleration was way too high.

Jon
SEM Servo Motors

John Ross
 

I pulled one of the servo motors from the Gantry router I picked up
yesterday. I says SEM Small Electrical Motor Company DC Servo Motor. Type
30R4-42 Const Stall Torque 28 Lb in. Max PRM 3200 Volts 135 Pulse Amps 52.
Where would I find a driver to power these things? The Camtronics Looks
like its 36 volts and 10A. Who makes a 135 V 52 amp servo amp?

John Ross
I-Link Worldwide
Re: EMC homing

Jon Elson
 

daveland@... wrote:

From: daveland@...

I feel embarased about this one...

I cannot get EMC to home an axis to zero?? I select the axis
and hit the "home" key...IT just takes off and incriments
forever (till I hit abort). Did I forget something?
Do you have a home switch? Is this an encoder-feedback system, or
stepper open-loop?

Jon
Re: Step motor current

Jon Elson
 

Ron Ginger wrote:

I also note that at certain speeds, while the motor is rampning up to
a
long move, the belts will vibrate a lot. They seem to steady out when
it
reaches steady speed. I have measured and I am not loosing steps, so
I
dont think its a motor resonance problem. Should I worry about this
vibratiopn?
This ocurrs when the length of belt causes it to resonate (like a guitar
string) at the
step frequency. It could cause some wiggles in the cut being made. If
not, I
wouldn't worry about it. There's not much you can do, either. The only
thing
I can think of is to have some springy material that touches the back
side of
the belt, but doesn't interfere with the movement of the carriage. This
would damp
out any vibrations.

Jon
Re: rtlinux-2.0

George Fouse
 

Hi Matt,
I built rt2.0 (2.2.13 kernel) without SMP support. It works fine for my
primary uses. I noted after the fact that INSTALL.phil had it enabled as
an example.
One thing you do need to note, though, is that EMC defines the __SMP__
flag, which will generate unresolved references (actually localized to
one .h file) if the kernel is built without SMP. I undefined __SMP__ and
EMC built fine. I haven't thoroughly tested it, though.
George
Matt Shaver wrote:

I don't think so, but I'm in the process of doing what you've done (get
RTL2.0 going for the EMC) and I'll let you know how it goes for me. Did you
mean that SMP support was turned on in that particular example, or that it
was turned on in the .config file for the pre-patched kernel?

Matt
-------------------------------
George Fouse,
President
G F I Consulting
-------------------------------
Re: rtlinux-2.0

Joel Jacobs
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Shaver" <mshaver@...>
is suppose to allow multiple CPU's - I only have one CPU. Does
multiprocessing support have to be turned on for hard real-time support
to
work even it you only have one CPU?
I don't think so, but I'm in the process of doing what you've done (get
RTL2.0 going for the EMC) and I'll let you know how it goes for me. Did
you
mean that SMP support was turned on in that particular example, or that it
was turned on in the .config file for the pre-patched kernel?

Matt
Hi Matt,
It was turned on in the example and to be honest, I can't remember how the
default config file was set up. I went through and played with the
settings. I got it compiled and working tho with SMP turned _off_ and one
of the example programs did seem to run ok that way. Then I was looking
over the install.phil file and saw that SMP was enabled.

Joel
Re: power feed, something different, power feed

 

Bill,

While you're waiting to tackle EMC you might give STEPSTER
a try. It's free and runs from dos through the parallel port.
Charles Gallo has been working on it for while and I think
it's available from his site:


Bob

At 01:13 PM 3/7/00 EST, you wrote:
From: wanliker@...

I believe that there a lot of list members out there that would like to get
Cam running but find it a bit daunting. I would like to suggest an easier
starting point in you quest.

I bought the 5 Amp stepper drivers from Dan at Camtronics.
<A href=">Click here: Home Page </A>


finding the Linux/EMC/CAM a bit daunting I found myself at a stand still.
Any of you feel the same way?

Last night I looked at the unit and asked myself what I was going to do,
then
it dawned on me that I could easily take the first step down the CAM path by
mounting the steppers, and using Dan's board as a driver, and I would have
power feed up and running. All one needs extra are limit switches, and the
step/direction control circuits.
Dan's board has an oscillator built in that can give you the steps, and a
switch will give direction. Then add limit switches to stop, or reverse the
circuit.
This way you will have something useful as you start down the road to a full
CAM operation in the future.

Dan, how about some comments on this.

469 members on the list today.
Bill
List Manager

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bill,
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Re: rtlinux-2.0

Matt Shaver
 

rtlinux-2.0

Joel Jacobs
 

Hi,
I've been wanting to try and get EMC running and thought a good start would
be to get the RT kernel working. I got the pre-patched 2.2.13 kernel from
rtlinux.org and managed to get it compiled and installed. There was an
installation example in there called install.phil that I followed and it
worked. The example had symmetric multiprocessing support turned on, which
is suppose to allow multiple CPU's - I only have one CPU. Does
multiprocessing support have to be turned on for hard real-time support to
work even it you only have one CPU?

Thanks...
Joel
Step motor current

Ron Ginger
 

I have my Grizley MiniMill working. I've taken some photos, will post
them to my web site when I get a chance.

For motors I used some NEMA 23 motors about 4" long that I found
surplus- the only speck I have is that they cost $15. They have no label
or makers name. They are the same size as the ones usually listed at
150-180 oz-in. They are 200 steps/rotation, and measure 2.4 ohm per
coil- ignoring the center tap.

I have a slo-syn 430-th driver module, selected because it was $10 at
the MIT flea market. It is capable of 3.5A, so I started runing the
motors with it at full current, but the motors seem to get very hot-
after 20-30 min they were to hot to hold onto. I lowered the current to
about 3 amps and the motors sounded smoother, still run as fast as my
program will drive them, but still get very warm.

So, how do I select a current for a motor when I dont have a spec?

I also note that at certain speeds, while the motor is rampning up to a
long move, the belts will vibrate a lot. They seem to steady out when it
reaches steady speed. I have measured and I am not loosing steps, so I
dont think its a motor resonance problem. Should I worry about this
vibratiopn?

ron
Re: Austrailian bipolar driver Kits

 

My 2A kit uses those L298's they are a fine chip but they really need a
heatsink over 1A. At 2A better make sure you have a good large heatsink and
a fan.
Dan
power feed, something different, power feed

 

I believe that there a lot of list members out there that would like to get
Cam running but find it a bit daunting. I would like to suggest an easier
starting point in you quest.

I bought the 5 Amp stepper drivers from Dan at Camtronics.
<A href=">Click here: Home Page </A>


finding the Linux/EMC/CAM a bit daunting I found myself at a stand still.
Any of you feel the same way?

Last night I looked at the unit and asked myself what I was going to do, then
it dawned on me that I could easily take the first step down the CAM path by
mounting the steppers, and using Dan's board as a driver, and I would have
power feed up and running. All one needs extra are limit switches, and the
step/direction control circuits.
Dan's board has an oscillator built in that can give you the steps, and a
switch will give direction. Then add limit switches to stop, or reverse the
circuit.
This way you will have something useful as you start down the road to a full
CAM operation in the future.

Dan, how about some comments on this.

469 members on the list today.
Bill
List Manager
Re: removing encoders from motor shaft

Bertho Boman
 

If you have a regular size mill, otherwise use a drill press:
Slide two plates under the bushing, one from each side and rest the plates on the wise or extra blocks. The encoder body now
hangs under the plates between the jaws or blocks.

Then put a dowel in the chuck and use it as a miniature arbor press to push out the shaft. That will allow you to gradually
increase the force in a controller manner.
Bertho Boman
===========================================

From: "Terry May" <tmay@...>

Joe,
I think you have the right idea, I'm going to try the same thing I
believe. I'll probably make two and try to squeeze them together with
a clamp or press and maybe keep from bending anything, hope it works.
Terry

--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@..., Joe Vicars <jvicars@c...> wrote:
I have the same problem Terry described removing delicate glass
encoder wheels from old plotter servo motors. I successfully
removed
one that was already broken by gently prying it off with a little
stanley nail puller. It takes a little pressure to break the
RTV-type
adhesive, but once you get it going it comes off smooth. It is very
dicey however, the encoders on the ones I have are only .007"
thick. I
think there is a better way.
I am going to make a wedge type tool to remove the other
encoders,
like a Jacobs taper chuck key. Looks like a little horseshoe with
shallow ramps on both sides.
Good luck.
Re: DRO UPDATE

Terry May
 

Dan,
I may well do that also in the future, I justed wanted to try
everything out with the lowest cost to start with. I like the idea of
getting away from the parallel port if possible.
Terry

--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@..., "Dan Mauch" <dmauch@s...> wrote:
That is why I gave up on steve's software and wenbt with Tom
Kulaga's
design.
Dan
-----Original Message-----
From: Terry May <tmay@...>
To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@... <CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...>
Date: Saturday, March 04, 2000 9:06 AM
Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] Re: RE: DRO UPDATE


From: "Terry May" <tmay@...>

Art,
I need some help here, I put together a circuit using a 74hct14
like you did but I can't seem to get it to work with a computer.
When
I run Steve Linsay's dro40 program it doesn't react to the movement
of the encoders. I've tried it on three different computers,
setting
the parallel ports to both ECP and EPP, there's just no movement of
the readout for any axis. I've tried it in a DOS window under 98
and
booting directly to DOS.
The part that's driving me crazy is that when I hook up the
encoders to a Pwr Sup and a scope I get good square waves out of
the
chip on all 6 lines to the parallel port connector. I've checked
the
wiring about a gazillion times but can't find any mistakes.
Using the parallel.exe program Steve included with his SW, the
ports look good, but when I use his Portstuf.exe hooking an
external
voltage to the port pin 2 and grd pin 22 doesn't have any effect. I
can change the port setting using the keyboard in the program but
that's it.
I don't have any other ways to check the ports that I know of,
but
when I hook a Snappy video capture device to the ports they work
fine.

Any ideas?
Thanks
Terry

--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@..., "A. G. Eckstein" <axtein@s...>
wrote:
Terry,
Thanks for the words of encouragement. I need that and hope my
little bit
will help. I appreciate all the words that I have gotten on the
site and as
things progress, will try to update it. My long term goal is to
get
to the
magical resolution of 0.0001"
Actually, when I started the goal was to get accuracy to 0.001"
with no
backlash. I have far exceeded that but now it is a challange.

Please let me know if I can help further.

Art

At 11:56 PM 02/28/2000 -0000, you wrote:
From: "Terry May" <tmay@...>

Art,
Just wanted to tell I have been looking at your website, great
pictures!! It really helps to visualize your setup as you have
been
discribing it on the list. I hope my DRO turns out to be half as
good
as yours.
Just a quick update from my shop, I didn't have any 7414's or
the
decrete transistors that Steve Linsay used on my bench so I just
played around a bit. Hooked up the encoders to my scope and
checked
out the waveform and then used a freq counter to do the same.
All
the
encoders look like they are working fine so after work tomorrow
I
will pickup some chips at Radio Shack and put together a board.
Concerning the discussions about wires/cables for the setup, I
have
lots of good parts left over from a dearly departed HP plotter.
Amoung the goodies are all the wires used to move the pen
holder, I
think they will be long enough for the Y and Z axis' of my
mill/drill
if not the x axis.
As I was playing with the encoder still hooked to the motor
and
reading it with the freq counter, I realized that just one
channel
out of a 1000 line encoder is a very nice division factor for a
tach????. I think I will experiment with that a little also.
Thanks again for sharing your experiences and your website!
Terry May
OLDER THAN DIRT

Country Bubba

(Actually the inventor of Country and Bubba)

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-------------------------

Welcome to CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...,an unmoderated list for the
discussion of shop built systems in the above catagories.
To Unsubscribe, read archives, change to or from digest.
Go to:
Log on, and you will go to Member Center, and you can make changes
there.
For the FAQ, go to
bill,
List Manager
Re: DRO UPDATE

Terry May
 

Art,
Thanks for the update, as I said in my reply to Joe I plan to try
the wedge method, I've been known to break a lot of stuff with
screwdrivers :>)
Terry

--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@..., "A. G. Eckstein" <axtein@s...>
wrote:
At 06:40 PM 03/05/2000 -0000, you wrote:
From: "Terry May" <tmay@...>

Art,
Here I am again asking questions... How did you get the encoder
wheel off of the motor shaft?
Terry, I just used to big screwdrivers and pryed the encoders off
the
shaftby pressing under the aluminum boss and used the screw heads
for the
plate as a fulcrum. They are a press fit.

Now that I am trying to do some other work, am building a small
press out
of some flat stock and some screws so I won't have to worry about
the
screwdrivers slipping (and that has happened)



I got the retaining ring off without
destroying the disc but can't seem to get the disc off the shaft.
It
appears to be bonded to the aluminum disk underneath it and that
acts
like it is a press fit on the shaft. I hesitate to apply too much
force trying to pry it off but am looking for clues.
On the other hand I have a bunch of small plastic pulleys with
ball
bearing centers that came out of the plotter that yielded the
cable I
plan to use. Since they have an ID enough larger than 5mm that I
think I can bush them to fit the encoder shafts, I plan to use
those
to run the cable over, seems like they would be less likely to have
any slippage since HP designed them to be used with the cable. Does
this sound reasonable to anyone, just looking for ideas.
Sounds good to me, good luck.

Art


A. G. Eckstein

axtein@...
Re: removing encoders from motor shaft

Terry May
 

Joe,
I think you have the right idea, I'm going to try the same thing I
believe. I'll probably make two and try to squeeze them together with
a clamp or press and maybe keep from bending anything, hope it works.
Terry

--- In CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@..., Joe Vicars <jvicars@c...> wrote:
I have the same problem Terry described removing delicate glass
encoder wheels from old plotter servo motors. I successfully
removed
one that was already broken by gently prying it off with a little
stanley nail puller. It takes a little pressure to break the
RTV-type
adhesive, but once you get it going it comes off smooth. It is very
dicey however, the encoders on the ones I have are only .007"
thick. I
think there is a better way.
I am going to make a wedge type tool to remove the other
encoders,
like a Jacobs taper chuck key. Looks like a little horseshoe with
shallow ramps on both sides.
Good luck.
Re: EMC homing

 

Do you have any homing switches hooked up? I have the homing working just
fine, but what it does is travel in the direction you set until it hits a
homing switch and then it pulls back and bumps into the switch again.

If you set the homing switch bit the opposite way (1 or 0) the axis will
home as soon as you click on Home.

Hope this helps.


Tim
[Denver, CO]

timg@... <mailto:timg@...>

-----Original Message-----
From: daveland@... [mailto:daveland@...]
Sent: Monday, March 06, 2000 10:50 PM
To: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO@...
Subject: [CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO] EMC homing


From: daveland@...

I feel embarased about this one...

I cannot get EMC to home an axis to zero?? I select the axis
and hit the "home" key...IT just takes off and incriments
forever (till I hit abort). Did I forget something?
Re: Parallel port pins

Darrell
 

Matt,
this helped a lot. Now How do I find out what pin is ESTOP looking at and a
few other simple things like HOME and AXIS switches. Are they in serial or
parallel as they are all on one pin?
Is there a list of what pins EMC uses/looks at? Can you select which pin
goes where?
I am working with a BOSS 6 and need to be able to enable the spindle, check
for spindle on, watch for ESTOP and connect to home switches.
If there is a list of pins for EMC it would sure help.
Darrell
Re: DRO UPDATE

A. G. Eckstein
 

At 06:40 PM 03/05/2000 -0000, you wrote:
From: "Terry May" <tmay@...>

Art,
Here I am again asking questions... How did you get the encoder
wheel off of the motor shaft?
Terry, I just used to big screwdrivers and pryed the encoders off the
shaftby pressing under the aluminum boss and used the screw heads for the
plate as a fulcrum. They are a press fit.

Now that I am trying to do some other work, am building a small press out
of some flat stock and some screws so I won't have to worry about the
screwdrivers slipping (and that has happened)



I got the retaining ring off without
destroying the disc but can't seem to get the disc off the shaft. It
appears to be bonded to the aluminum disk underneath it and that acts
like it is a press fit on the shaft. I hesitate to apply too much
force trying to pry it off but am looking for clues.
On the other hand I have a bunch of small plastic pulleys with ball
bearing centers that came out of the plotter that yielded the cable I
plan to use. Since they have an ID enough larger than 5mm that I
think I can bush them to fit the encoder shafts, I plan to use those
to run the cable over, seems like they would be less likely to have
any slippage since HP designed them to be used with the cable. Does
this sound reasonable to anyone, just looking for ideas.
Sounds good to me, good luck.

Art


A. G. Eckstein

axtein@...
Re: Larken amps

Harrison, Doug
 

OOPS! I got the website from someone on this list and assumed ........ er
.... um..... well, we all know what assume is an acronym for. Sorry
folks.



Doug

-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Fortune [SMTP:pentam@...]
Sent: Monday, March 06, 2000 7:38 PM
To: Harrison, Doug
Subject: Larken amps

Harrison, Doug wrote:

From: "Harrison, Doug" <dharrison@...>

I have been studying the Larken website and am interested in their
stepper
drivers. They have a model that is rated for 4-8 amps at 50V and sells
for
$199. It has quarter stepping, idle cutback and (supposedly) easily
replaceable FET's. Sounds pretty good. Has anyone used these, and if
so,
what's your opinion? Having been burned with Microkinetics, I tend to
be
careful these days.
Why don't you mention the website? Its always extra work for the 400
of us on this list to go searching for it....
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