Re: understanding CGE pro mount
Hi Ray, Thank you so much for this.? As a non engineer these problems appear like mountains when really they are molehills! (I hope) I didn't have the mount connected to the computer as I was left a prehistoric serial A (RS 232) which went out with the dinosaurs!? I'm trying to find either conversion or new cable. As to the RA/DEC cables they're "Iffy" and I guess their replacement easily solves one possible source of errors. I'm getting a buddy from Vernon Telescopes to bring a better power supply,? I'm starving the mount with 0.5A when it needs, apparently, 2.5 - 5A
Can you tell me the identity of the two ports with silver caps? underneath? both? the RA and DEC motor drives?
Thanks again!? The online astro community has been a lifeline to me.? Keep in touch, and, thanks again; I'll let you know how?it goes.
Tim French
On Sun, Mar 7, 2021 at 9:48 AM Ray Stann < raystann@...> wrote:
Hi Tim.
?
I have two setups just like yours and I actually had the
same problem in RA.? I?replaced the motor thinking that was the
problem, but it wasn't.? A service tech from Celestron turned me onto the
cable.? I undid both ends of the RA cable and?put them back and the
mount worked again.? I was fortunate in that, besides having a spare motor
(which wasn't needed as it turned out) to also having a spare cable, so I
replaced the RA cable just to be on the safe side.? You might try this and
see if it works.
?
Now, after saying all that, I was at my remote observatory
last night and everything worked well until I tried to send the motors back to
the switches.? You guessed it - the RA motor wouldn't move.? I was
using NexRemote.? As a test I disconnected the cable to the PC and plugged
in the HC and, surprisingly, everything worked well.? I suspect that the
issue last night was a bad PC connection.
?
Regarding error 17, there are a couple of possible causes
there.? A bad cable is one, but also you might get that error if you had
both the PC cable connected and the HC at the same time.
?
Ray Stann
Intro, I'm in the final few weeks of an observatory build and have
bought a new C14 edgehd to go on a secondhand (hefty eh!) CGE - pro mount.?
It will go onto a concrete pier with a custom made pier plate.
I have the mount on its?tripod?next? to me as I get to know
it!!
I know it had been discontinued but for my budget, at the time it was a
good fit.? I do have a BSc. hons in Astronomy and Physics when I was in the
UK.now in Canada, BC.? However times and telescopes change.
My main problem........ The RA drive just stopped while heading East!?
Then 90 degrees west quit again.? I thought it might be switch position or
RA limits rather than a bad motor/encoder that I have read about.? But,
then I noticed that the power adaptor that I was using - from my old C10- NGT on
the CG5 mount - was only 0.5A!? The CGE pro needs 3-5A I discovered!?
Also, the 2 RA/DEC connectors look....used and I will replace.
Do you think the RA problem might be a power issue?? A few moments ago
as I powered up to play with the pro a bit, it came up with "error 17 recycle
power"? I think that the mount is good, I need to learn some more which is
fine but what do you think.anyone?
I managed to tear my bicep trying to lift the jolly thing too!?
Ow!
Cheers?
Tim French
|
Re: understanding CGE pro mount
Hi Tim.
?
I have two setups just like yours and I actually had the
same problem in RA.? I?replaced the motor thinking that was the
problem, but it wasn't.? A service tech from Celestron turned me onto the
cable.? I undid both ends of the RA cable and?put them back and the
mount worked again.? I was fortunate in that, besides having a spare motor
(which wasn't needed as it turned out) to also having a spare cable, so I
replaced the RA cable just to be on the safe side.? You might try this and
see if it works.
?
Now, after saying all that, I was at my remote observatory
last night and everything worked well until I tried to send the motors back to
the switches.? You guessed it - the RA motor wouldn't move.? I was
using NexRemote.? As a test I disconnected the cable to the PC and plugged
in the HC and, surprisingly, everything worked well.? I suspect that the
issue last night was a bad PC connection.
?
Regarding error 17, there are a couple of possible causes
there.? A bad cable is one, but also you might get that error if you had
both the PC cable connected and the HC at the same time.
?
Ray Stann
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
Intro, I'm in the final few weeks of an observatory build and have
bought a new C14 edgehd to go on a secondhand (hefty eh!) CGE - pro mount.?
It will go onto a concrete pier with a custom made pier plate.
I have the mount on its?tripod?next? to me as I get to know
it!!
I know it had been discontinued but for my budget, at the time it was a
good fit.? I do have a BSc. hons in Astronomy and Physics when I was in the
UK.now in Canada, BC.? However times and telescopes change.
My main problem........ The RA drive just stopped while heading East!?
Then 90 degrees west quit again.? I thought it might be switch position or
RA limits rather than a bad motor/encoder that I have read about.? But,
then I noticed that the power adaptor that I was using - from my old C10- NGT on
the CG5 mount - was only 0.5A!? The CGE pro needs 3-5A I discovered!?
Also, the 2 RA/DEC connectors look....used and I will replace.
Do you think the RA problem might be a power issue?? A few moments ago
as I powered up to play with the pro a bit, it came up with "error 17 recycle
power"? I think that the mount is good, I need to learn some more which is
fine but what do you think.anyone?
I managed to tear my bicep trying to lift the jolly thing too!?
Ow!
Cheers?
Tim French
|
understanding CGE pro mount
Intro, I'm in the final few weeks of an observatory build and have bought a new C14 edgehd to go on a secondhand (hefty eh!) CGE - pro mount.? It will go onto a concrete pier with a custom made pier plate. I have the mount on its?tripod?next? to me as I get to know it!!
I know it had been discontinued but for my budget, at the time it was a good fit.? I do have a BSc. hons in Astronomy and Physics when I was in the UK.now in Canada, BC.? However times and telescopes change. My main problem........ The RA drive just stopped while heading East!? Then 90 degrees west quit again.? I thought it might be switch position or RA limits rather than a bad motor/encoder that I have read about.? But, then I noticed that the power adaptor that I was using - from my old C10- NGT on the CG5 mount - was only 0.5A!? The CGE pro needs 3-5A I discovered!? Also, the 2 RA/DEC connectors look....used and I will replace. Do you think the RA problem might be a power issue?? A few moments ago as I powered up to play with the pro a bit, it came up with "error 17 recycle power"? I think that the mount is good, I need to learn some more which is fine but what do you think.anyone?
I managed to tear my bicep trying to lift the jolly thing too!? Ow!
Cheers? Tim French
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Glad to hear things are working well. Just to clarify, the socket and plug I was referring to was the one inside the hand controller, not the main mount panel. This is a very small socket on the HC pc board so worth examining very closely if the symptom ever recurs.? ?Good luck ,
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Mar 1, 2021, at 8:54 AM, Nick <nbill1797@...> wrote:
? Hi everyone,
Hope you guys had a nice weekend. I¡¯d like to share an update on the fault topic incase anyone else has the same issue in the future.?
After disconnecting the power, I removed the panel housing the main board to check all connections. I checked out the solder as well to make sure nothing was burned or broken. There may have been a loose plug-in connection as Scott suggested. While I was at it I opened up the back of the HC too. Didn¡¯t really see anything out of the ordinary there.?
I did replace the original AC power supply with the new one. It sounds really good now. It seemed to run stronger with the new power supply. Overall?I ran it for about 20 mins on Saturday night and another 20 mins or so last night. The fault did not trip one time yay! I even ran it on DC power with no faults... I¡¯ll call this a win!?
Maybe it was a combination of both??..who knows. Either way it¡¯s looking good now.
Thank you Gents for your guidance.
Hope you all have great week ?
Nick
?
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Hi everyone,
Hope you guys had a nice weekend. I¡¯d like to share an update on the fault topic incase anyone else has the same issue in the future.?
After disconnecting the power, I removed the panel housing the main board to check all connections. I checked out the solder as well to make sure nothing was burned or broken. There may have been a loose plug-in connection as Scott suggested. While I was at it I opened up the back of the HC too. Didn¡¯t really see anything out of the ordinary there.?
I did replace the original AC power supply with the new one. It sounds really good now. It seemed to run stronger with the new power supply. Overall?I ran it for about 20 mins on Saturday night and another 20 mins or so last night. The fault did not trip one time yay! I even ran it on DC power with no faults... I¡¯ll call this a win!?
Maybe it was a combination of both??..who knows. Either way it¡¯s looking good now.
Thank you Gents for your guidance.
Hope you all have great week ?
Nick
?
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Hi Nick, ? ? ?I assume that the problem is not what I suggested. Did you figure it out?
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 25, 2021, at 11:42 AM, nbill1797@... wrote:
? Hi Scott,
Good explanation. This sounds easy enough to walk through. I hope it¡¯s simply a loose connection. I¡¯ll give it a shot this afternoon with everything unplugged. Look for an update.
Thanks for your kindness!?
-Nick
?
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Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Try spreading the pins inside the connection port. Also, try cleaning the HC plug and the HC and aux ports with electronics spray cleaner. Also, once it is cleaned, get some rubber plugs off ebay to protect from dust. This has helped mine.
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Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Hey Steven,
Unfortunately I do not know much on the history of the mount. It sounded like it got minimal use for the last few years. It wasn¡¯t the main pc of equipment for the gentleman I purchased from.
You¡¯re right, I¡¯m sure the grease could be removed and replaced. I plan on taking on the task once I can get passed the fault code issue. I have Super Lube on order.?
Thanks for the article. Sure sounds like she¡¯s under-powered. I¡¯ll give it a go and provide an update.?
Wishing you great seeing!?
-Nick
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Hi Scott,
Good explanation. This sounds easy enough to walk through. I hope it¡¯s simply a loose connection. I¡¯ll give it a shot this afternoon with everything unplugged. Look for an update.
Thanks for your kindness!?
-Nick
?
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
The 5000 mA is only the maximal current the power supply will be able to give. Whats important is the voltage that must be the same (probably 12 V) as the expected.
Niklas
25 februari 2021 08:04:08 +01:00, skrev andoverobservatory via groups.io <SJamiem16@...>:
Nick,
?Forgot to point out that you should make sure the power supply is disconnected from the mount because you don¡¯t want to risk electrical damage by having it powered while you are working on it. If you are concerned about doing the work on the controller, I am sure someone in the club that is local could do it.
Scott
On Feb 25, 2021, at 12:23 AM, nbill1797@... wrote:
?
Hi Everyone,
New member here. I¡¯m taking my time learning my new (used) CGEM mount. It was purchased second hand in late December and its seems to be finicky. It¡¯s giving me a ¡°no response 16 /17¡± error. What¡¯s weird is it doesn¡¯t do it all the time.?
The code came up a few times while using my deep cycle battery. I decided to try with the included AC adapter. Again, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn¡¯t.?
I thought it could be possible the deep cycle cell AND the AC power supply could be bad or at best going out around the same time. The mount is suspected to be made around 2007-2010.?
So...I purchased a new power supply which brings me to my question. The Celestron new power supply is 5000mA compared to the one that was included with the mount is 2500mA. Is it safe to plug in the new power supply at the higher mA??
I don¡¯t want to make a mistake so I thought maybe someone could lend some advice or maybe had a similar experience.?
See attached.
<FC780F87-B1B8-406F-84EE-6A882A1CB806.jpeg>
<28F56882-8FF8-44E8-A0D2-D8E2AAC7585E.jpeg>
Any help is appreciated! :)?
-Nick
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Nick,
?Forgot to point out that you should make sure the power supply is disconnected from the mount because you don¡¯t want to risk electrical damage by having it powered while you are working on it. If you are concerned about doing the work on the controller, I am sure someone in the club that is local could do it. Scott
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 25, 2021, at 12:23 AM, nbill1797@... wrote:
? Hi Everyone,
New member here. I¡¯m taking my time learning my new (used) CGEM mount. It was purchased second hand in late December and its seems to be finicky. It¡¯s giving me a ¡°no response 16 /17¡± error. What¡¯s weird is it doesn¡¯t do it all the time.?
The code came up a few times while using my deep cycle battery. I decided to try with the included AC adapter. Again, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn¡¯t.?
I thought it could be possible the deep cycle cell AND the AC power supply could be bad or at best going out around the same time. The mount is suspected to be made around 2007-2010.?
So...I purchased a new power supply which brings me to my question. The Celestron new power supply is 5000mA compared to the one that was included with the mount is 2500mA. Is it safe to plug in the new power supply at the higher mA??
I don¡¯t want to make a mistake so I thought maybe someone could lend some advice or maybe had a similar experience.?
See attached. <FC780F87-B1B8-406F-84EE-6A882A1CB806.jpeg> <28F56882-8FF8-44E8-A0D2-D8E2AAC7585E.jpeg>
Any help is appreciated! :)?
-Nick
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Yes you can use the AC power supply. That¡¯s the same one I use on my CGEM.?
Do you have any history on the mount like if it was serviced during its lifetime? ?The grease can get thicker over time and parts do wear out.
Here¡¯s a link to the error message?It means a loss of communication to the DEC or RA boards.?
hope this helps.?
steven
|
Re: AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Nick,? ? ? The ma rating your seeing is just how much current it can supply if the scope needs it. As long the new supply is equal or higher in current (ma) as the old supply it¡¯s fine. As long as it is recommended for your Celestron ?mount, the voltage should be right and that¡¯s the important number. ? ? I had a very similar problem with my mount and it turned out to be the cable going into the hand controller was coming out of its pc board socket. Just carefully remove the four screws from the back cover and look for the wire coming in. ?Carefully push the wire connector back into its socket . if ?it has come completely out of its socket be careful to line the pins up with the holes in the socket using the edges of the connector for alignment. ?It may not be the problem but I have seen the same issue in three controllers and it fixed it every time so good luck and enjoy your telescope! Feel free to call if you have any questions, I am retired so am available most times. ?Scott Jamieson Point Plover Observatory. ?- Plover, WI 2624428498
toggle quoted message
Show quoted text
On Feb 25, 2021, at 12:23 AM, nbill1797@... wrote:
? Hi Everyone,
New member here. I¡¯m taking my time learning my new (used) CGEM mount. It was purchased second hand in late December and its seems to be finicky. It¡¯s giving me a ¡°no response 16 /17¡± error. What¡¯s weird is it doesn¡¯t do it all the time.?
The code came up a few times while using my deep cycle battery. I decided to try with the included AC adapter. Again, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn¡¯t.?
I thought it could be possible the deep cycle cell AND the AC power supply could be bad or at best going out around the same time. The mount is suspected to be made around 2007-2010.?
So...I purchased a new power supply which brings me to my question. The Celestron new power supply is 5000mA compared to the one that was included with the mount is 2500mA. Is it safe to plug in the new power supply at the higher mA??
I don¡¯t want to make a mistake so I thought maybe someone could lend some advice or maybe had a similar experience.?
See attached. <FC780F87-B1B8-406F-84EE-6A882A1CB806.jpeg> <28F56882-8FF8-44E8-A0D2-D8E2AAC7585E.jpeg>
Any help is appreciated! :)?
-Nick
|
AC power supply for CGEM, no response fault code
Hi Everyone,
New member here. I¡¯m taking my time learning my new (used) CGEM mount. It was purchased second hand in late December and its seems to be finicky. It¡¯s giving me a ¡°no response 16 /17¡± error. What¡¯s weird is it doesn¡¯t do it all the time.?
The code came up a few times while using my deep cycle battery. I decided to try with the included AC adapter. Again, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn¡¯t.?
I thought it could be possible the deep cycle cell AND the AC power supply could be bad or at best going out around the same time. The mount is suspected to be made around 2007-2010.?
So...I purchased a new power supply which brings me to my question. The Celestron new power supply is 5000mA compared to the one that was included with the mount is 2500mA. Is it safe to plug in the new power supply at the higher mA??
I don¡¯t want to make a mistake so I thought maybe someone could lend some advice or maybe had a similar experience.?
See attached. 
Any help is appreciated! :)?
-Nick
|
Re: HOMEYER CRADLE REPLICA
thanks for this Frank, you have confirmed my thoughts about OAG and SCTs. I use feathertouch and microtouch for focus control, so OAG is probably my only option.
Interesting mods you've done and I can se they'd be really helpful. Paul
On Mon, 8 Feb 2021 at 05:23, Frank S Barnes III < SBarnes@...> wrote: Hi Paul,
Due to the design of an SCT, stabilizing the mirror is a complicated task. you can't "lock" the mirror, but you can do some things that will minimize the shift as it tracks from east to west. My C14 has been modified to address the shift created by the gap between the baffle tube and the draw tube. The mirror can also shift on the mirror mount itself and you cannot tighten the spanner nut enough to eliminate it without deforming the mirror, so modification #2 addressed applying pressure to the outer edges of the mirror in 3 locations to hold it steady. And the third modification was the addition of longer bolts to replace the transfer bolts that hold the mirror during shipment. Those bolts are too short to reach the mirror support once the mirror has be brought close to focus. This requires an external focuser since once all the stabilization is done, the mirror is basically fixed. These mods allowed me to use a guidescope with pretty good success. However, the best approach is as you suggest, use an OAG and separate guide camera. A good rotator is worth its weight in gold if guidestars are sparse and only found in one orientation.
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Re: HOMEYER CRADLE REPLICA
Hi Paul,
Due to the design of an SCT, stabilizing the mirror is a complicated task. you can't "lock" the mirror, but you can do some things that will minimize the shift as it tracks from east to west. My C14 has been modified to address the shift created by the gap between the baffle tube and the draw tube. The mirror can also shift on the mirror mount itself and you cannot tighten the spanner nut enough to eliminate it without deforming the mirror, so modification #2 addressed applying pressure to the outer edges of the mirror in 3 locations to hold it steady. And the third modification was the addition of longer bolts to replace the transfer bolts that hold the mirror during shipment. Those bolts are too short to reach the mirror support once the mirror has be brought close to focus. This requires an external focuser since once all the stabilization is done, the mirror is basically fixed. These mods allowed me to use a guidescope with pretty good success. However, the best approach is as you suggest, use an OAG and separate guide camera. A good rotator is worth its weight in gold if guidestars are sparse and only found in one orientation.
|
Re: HOMEYER CRADLE REPLICA
Hi Frank - how did you find guiding your C14 by using a separate scope? Did it work effectively? I have just 'upgraded' from a C11 to a non edge C14. When using the C11, I couln't guide with a separate scope as mirror shift was problematic. I am guessing the same problem will happen with my C14, so I'm thinking to use OAG again. Separate guiding scopes give so much more choice of guide star - it would be great if it worked.
thanks
Paul
|
Re: HOMEYER CRADLE REPLICA
I also have one of Andy's cradles. Back when Andy made it, we discussed how best to add additional scopes for different uses. Moment arm was always a concern of Andy's, as he never liked overloading a mount. Our solution was to modify the cradle by adding mounting holes on the bottom flat edges to accept Losmandy plates. The result of that effort was a very versatile setup, but not one that stressed the Paramount. Here is a picture of the final configuration. I could guide with either refractor while imaging with the C14, or image with a refractor while guiding with the other one. All this worked well with the exception of the C14 mirror movement. But after 3 to 4 different mirror stabilizing experiments, the images became quite acceptable. ?
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Re: HOMEYER CRADLE REPLICA
Here is a pic during setup. It shows the symmetry and you can gauge the strength easy enough. Currently re-housing this gear at a remote site in Tasmania in a much bigger observatory.
Making the reflection cradles is pretty easy. You can get the aluminium laser cut just and use the original holes in the Homeyer to bolt it all together using 10mm stainless bolts. I created a .dxf file for an aluminium fabricator to use. They loaded it up into their cutting system and they were done in a day. Its a relatively simple fix for a very irritating issue. This setup required an extension bar for the PME II using 4 CW's but I am contemplating replacing this with another locally made 20+kg weight
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Re: HOMEYER CRADLE REPLICA
I think the machine shop I'm using for my cradle uses a CNC high pressure waterjet for things of this size, I'm no engineer, but when you see it working, it's amazing.
Paul
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Steven
