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I know we are all on pins and needles waiting on more photos/details . But was wonder the PiZero 2w, I assume it's not hardwired
into the zbitx and that in the future should there be a PiZero 3 that we would be able to swap that out??
?
Thanks
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There are pictures of the RF board here, and they show it with a standard 40 pin female connector that will mate with the 40 pin header (2x20) used on all Raspberry Pi models. Presumably the RPi will have pins installed to plug into the board, either as a HAT (pins on the top of the RPi) or a base (pins on the bottom of the RPi). So it should be possible to swap in a future Raspberry Pi Zero board that uses the same form factor, but obviously no guarantees of compatibility with an unannounced product.
On Sun, Jan 5, 2025 at 12:51?AM David T-- VE3TOS via <digiital= [email protected]> wrote: ?
I know we are all on pins and needles waiting on more photos/details . But was wonder the PiZero 2w, I assume it's not hardwired
into the zbitx and that in the future should there be a PiZero 3 that we would be able to swap that out??
?
Thanks
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Darn. I was for some reason thinking it was another footprint , kept thinking it was more of the pi pico layout.??
Guess my question was answered. Thanks?
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Acknowledging that there are no stated plans for a newer model of RPi Zero, prospectively named RPi Zero 3, it is a safe assumption that were such a board be announced it would have the same form-factor and similar/same pin outs and connections, and if that is indeed what is released it could conceivably be swapped into the zBitx.
The real question is, in my opinion, does the RPi Zero 2W *only* connect to the 2x20 (40 pin) GPIO header, because that would mean any RPi with a 2x20 header could be used with the zBitx board.
It is interesting to see the posts here about the possibility of upgrading/swapping the RPi in a device that has not been released yet. The latest thread (this one) is now questioning upgrades for the unreleased zBitx with a future RPi Zero model that also is not only not released but not even being discussed as a future product!
(Opinion: Any updated RPi Zero would likely have either the RPi 4 or 5 CPU, and probably a bit more RAM, but that more recent CPU might need a cooling solution, either a heat sink or something active, and that might interfere with the initial, as yet not finalized, zBitx design.)
The RPi Zero 2W has the same processor chip as an RPi 3B+, albeit with half the memory. Farhan has said that the supplied/planned software suite works fine in the 512 Meg of RAM.
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On Jan 5, 2025, at 00:51, David T-- VE3TOS via groups.io <digiital@...> wrote:
? ?
I know we are all on pins and needles waiting on more photos/details . But was wonder the PiZero 2w, I assume it's not hardwired
into the zbitx and that in the future should there be a PiZero 3 that we would be able to swap that out??
?
Thanks
|
I wondered why something like the orange pi wasn’t used instead of the raspberry pi. ?Nearly the same foot print, same price, ?and more memory. ?But backwards compatibility with the sbitx and board reliability will be major factors. ?This is still after all a radio that is expected to be hacked on and tinkered with. ?I had concerns about ram but it looks like zram compression is a viable option on the zero at the expense of processor usage which we may have a bit in excess of on a zero 2 with its quad cores. ?The price point of this radio makes it perfect to hack on. So there is bound to be a lot of discussion on what you can tinker with even before it comes out! ?
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Ryan
kk6dzb
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Orange Pi models seem to come and go rapidly. Raspberry Pi commits to long term availability and software support, making their boards a safer choice for embedding.
On Sun, Jan 5, 2025, 11:41?AM Ryan Wesolowski via <cosmo1stgen= [email protected]> wrote: I wondered why something like the orange pi wasn’t used instead of the raspberry pi.? Nearly the same foot print, same price, ?and more memory.? But backwards compatibility with the sbitx and board reliability will be major factors.? This is still after all a radio that is expected to be hacked on and tinkered with.? I had concerns about ram but it looks like zram compression is a viable option on the zero at the expense of processor usage which we may have a bit in excess of on a zero 2 with its quad cores.? The price point of this radio makes it perfect to hack on. So there is bound to be a lot of discussion on what you can tinker with even before it comes out! ?
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Ryan
kk6dzb
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The RPi Zero 2W will be in production into the year 2030.
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Farhan has never expressed doubts about the RPi Zero 2W and its ability to control the zBitx, and I defer to him. If I was to have any concerns about the design, it would be the reliance on microSD cards, but that can easily be mitigated with easy access to the microSD card slot (couple of screws to access the slot?) and a practice of taking periodic backups.
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On Jan 5, 2025, at 12:02, Shirley Dulcey KE1L <mark@...> wrote:
Orange Pi models seem to come and go rapidly. Raspberry Pi commits to long term availability and software support, making their boards a safer choice for embedding.
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An Orange Pi-02W is a cool upgrade in the zBITX.?
Software adaption could be a challenge?
de VU2UPX?
Acknowledging that there are no stated plans for a newer model of RPi Zero, prospectively named RPi Zero 3, it is a safe assumption that were such a board be announced it would have the same form-factor and similar/same pin outs and connections, and if that is indeed what is released it could conceivably be swapped into the zBitx.
The real question is, in my opinion, does the RPi Zero 2W *only* connect to the 2x20 (40 pin) GPIO header, because that would mean any RPi with a 2x20 header could be used with the zBitx board.
It is interesting to see the posts here about the possibility of upgrading/swapping the RPi in a device that has not been released yet. The latest thread (this one) is now questioning upgrades for the unreleased zBitx with a future RPi Zero model that also is not only not released but not even being discussed as a future product!
(Opinion: Any updated RPi Zero would likely have either the RPi 4 or 5 CPU, and probably a bit more RAM, but that more recent CPU might need a cooling solution, either a heat sink or something active, and that might interfere with the initial, as yet not finalized, zBitx design.)
The RPi Zero 2W has the same processor chip as an RPi 3B+, albeit with half the memory. Farhan has said that the supplied/planned software suite works fine in the 512 Meg of RAM. Ken, N2VIP ? ?
I know we are all on pins and needles waiting on more photos/details . But was wonder the PiZero 2w, I assume it's not hardwired
into the zbitx and that in the future should there be a PiZero 3 that we would be able to swap that out??
?
Thanks
|
People are thinking about possible future needs for a more powerful CPU and/or more RAM. Future digital modes or improvements in the DSP algorithms might require more resources. People might want to experiment with changes to the front panel that would show more information. Simultaneous?reception of more than one signal within the passband of the crystal filter is another possibility. We might see a large-scale movement toward digital voice on HF. That Zero 2 W might be fine now, but will it be enough in five or ten years, or will the radio's features feel unnecessarily dated because of a lack of resources? Being able to upgrade the processor in the future could allow it to keep up with changes in ham radio.
It's not unprecedented. The Elecraft K2 got a processor upgrade partway through its life; version 2 firmware replaced the original 16F primary microcontroller with an 18F part; pin compatible, but with a larger instruction set and more RAM and flash storage. (The K2 main microcontroller, as well as the other microcontrollers in the rig, use flash memory but cannot be re-flashed by the customer; you have to pull out the microcontroller and replace it with one with a newer version of the firmware.) PC-based SDRs get a hardware upgrade by replacing the PC that is used as part of the radio with a more powerful one, and for some owners it was pretty much necessary because the newer SmartSDR software uses more resources than their original PowerSDR application did. (Others don't have a choice; some early Flex models are not supported by SmartSDR, and the newer direct sampling models are not supported by PowerSDR.)
The RPi Zero 2W will be in production into the year 2030.
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Farhan has never expressed doubts about the RPi Zero 2W and its ability to control the zBitx, and I defer to him. If I was to have any concerns about the design, it would be the reliance on microSD cards, but that can easily be mitigated with easy access to the microSD card slot (couple of screws to access the slot?) and a practice of taking periodic backups.
Ken, N2VIP On Jan 5, 2025, at 12:02, Shirley Dulcey KE1L <mark@...> wrote:
Orange Pi models seem to come and go rapidly. Raspberry Pi commits to long term availability and software support, making their boards a safer choice for embedding.
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I wondered why something like the orange pi wasn’t used instead of the raspberry pi. ?Nearly the same foot print, same price, ?and more memory. ?But backwards compatibility with the sbitx and board reliability will be major factors. ?This is still after all a radio that is expected to be hacked on and tinkered with. ?I had concerns about ram but it looks like zram compression is a viable option on the zero at the expense of processor usage which we may have a bit in excess of on a zero 2 with its quad cores. ?The price point of this radio makes it perfect to hack on. So there is bound to be a lot of discussion on what you can tinker with even before it comes out! ?
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The advantage that the Raspberry Pi has over any other embedded solution is the extensive software and community support.
There is absolutely no support for the Orange Pi apart from via Armbian.
The Orange Pi support for Wifi on their lower end boards is particuarly bad.
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On Jan 6, 2025, at 01:42, Shirley Dulcey KE1L <mark@...> wrote:
That Zero 2 W might be fine now, but will it be enough in five or ten years Seriously? "Five or ten years"? As I said earlier, the question is the interface between the RPi and the zBitx, is it purely though the 2x20 GPIO header pins? If yes, then clearly any RPi with the same 2x20 GPIO interface could control the board, but the physical connection may not be as simple as with an RPi Zero board - for example, a short IDC cable might be needed to physically connect the two boards (RPi 4, 5 or other and zBitx). Ken, N2VIP
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A larger Raspberry Pi board will work with the RF board, but it won't fit in the case. Some users will consider it important to preserve that form factor.
> On Jan 6, 2025, at 01:42, Shirley Dulcey KE1L <mark@...> wrote:
>
> That Zero 2 W might be fine now, but will it be enough in five or ten years
Seriously? "Five or ten years"?
As I said earlier, the question is the interface between the RPi and the zBitx, is it purely though the 2x20 GPIO header pins? If yes, then clearly any RPi with the same 2x20 GPIO interface could control the board, but the physical connection may not be as simple as with an RPi Zero board - for example, a short IDC cable might be needed to physically connect the two boards (RPi 4, 5 or other and zBitx).
Ken, N2VIP
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I think the Pico Pi is only used for the display and encoders. The Pico is a pretty powerful dual core microcontroller that people have implemented full SDRs on. A step to more resources in the same form factor could be to move more load on the Pico. In particular, real time tasks are well suited since as a controller it doesn't have an OS randomly interrupting it.
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73
??? Bob? KD8CGH
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One problem with running a full size newer pi over the zero will be the power consumption.? The zbitx is using a linear regulator for the PI and not a switcher like the sbitx.? It will get hot.? I haven't looked at the zbitx schematic but the regulator may be undersized for a pi 4 or 5.? Still after reading up on memory compression it may be a moot point for an upgrade for more memory intensive software.? Only 1 way to find out is run as many programs as you can on a zbitx and see what happens!
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Ryan
KK6DZB
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It would be useful to start a zBitx chapter in the Wiki.
73 - Pierre - FK8IH
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Shirley Dulcey KE1L
Bob Benedict, KD8CGH